#FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE

[flowerkatie]

So, let's get this straight, since, as I said, you're quite new to the forums, and I haven't seen what your viewpoint is to date - which previous suggestions did you consider to be terrible? Since that is aligned with the general subject of this thread. Can you state that clearly?

Square has been provided with extensive and detailed suggestions from not one, but multiple healers with years of experience.

You started this conversation referring to "extensive" and "detailed" suggestions and in that response and every response since, you've not provided a single link or said which suggestions you consider to be "extensive".

A large majority of these suggestions believe that part of the issue in healers is that their Damage rotation is not engaging, they believe that because most of our time is spent doing damage it should be engaging to do so. Yet, these same individuals admit that damage is a "filler" to healing. The real issue is that healing is simply oversaturated, in easy content the damage does not justify the healing we have and in difficult content we're given two healers where one could suffice meaning that almost all healers who are worth their salt will be spending all GCD on damage and oGCD on healing. The solution isn't to continue spending all GCD's on damage but in a more engaging way, it is to actually make healing required.

Now, please — I doubt your next response will reference any of these 'detailed' and 'extensive' suggestions but I hope you prove me wrong and actually give us something to discuss.

[Supersnow845]

You started this conversation referring to "extensive" and "detailed" suggestions and in that response and every response since, you've not provided a single link or said which suggestions you consider to be "extensive".

A large majority of these suggestions believe that part of the issue in healers is that their Damage rotation is not engaging, they believe that because most of our time is spent doing damage it should be engaging to do so. Yet, these same individuals admit that damage is a "filler" to healing. The real issue is that healing is simply oversaturated, in easy content the damage does not justify the healing we have and in difficult content we're given two healers where one could suffice meaning that almost all healers who are worth their salt will be spending all GCD on damage and oGCD on healing. The solution isn't to continue spending all GCD's on damage but in a more engaging way, it is to actually make healing required.

Now, please — I doubt your next response will reference any of these 'detailed' and 'extensive' suggestions but I hope you prove me wrong and actually give us something to discuss.

I mean you are unhappy with responses because you have unilaterally decided what’s important to fix healers and then haven’t factored in the fact we’ve done this song and dance before

You say “the problem isn’t the damage rotation it’s the fact we need to heal in a more engaging way” but there is plenty of people who won’t support any change that forces greater reliance on the healer, it’s why a lot of people ask for better damage rotation

[flowerkatie]

I mean you are unhappy with responses because you have unilaterally decided what’s important to fix healers and then haven’t factored in the fact we’ve done this song and dance before

You say “the problem isn’t the damage rotation it’s the fact we need to heal in a more engaging way” but there is plenty of people who won’t support any change that forces greater reliance on the healer, it’s why a lot of people ask for better damage rotation

Wrong assumptions, I've already had two people respond to me the argument something similar to "We've tried to ask for what you want, but they told us to do Ultimate's, so now we're asking for this". So yes, I have factored in that this discussion has been going on for a long while, I have also not decided what is important to fix. I simply disagree with some of the fixes proposed. I don't see your point.

Edit: Not only that, the whole point of "but there is plenty of people who won’t support any change that forces greater reliance on the healer, it’s why a lot of people ask for better damage rotation" is just confusing to me, there are also plenty of people who wont support the change of a better damage rotation. There are a lot of individuals who think that healers shouldn't even have to do damage. So you're just bouncing from one point that is mixed to another that is (maybe slightly?) less mixed but still mixed.

[Supersnow845]

Wrong assumptions, I've already had two people respond to me the argument something similar to "We've tried to ask for what you want, but they told us to do Ultimate's, so now we're asking for this". So yes, I have factored in that this discussion has been going on for a long while, I have also not decided what is important to fix. I simply disagree with some of the fixes proposed. I don't see your point.

You literally said in the post I quoted “the solution isn’t to continue to spend all GCD’s on damage but in a more engaging way, it is to make healing actually required”. That is a direct quote from you

So you have decided your “fix” to healers is to make the healing side more engaging and more necessary in normal content. On its own it’s not a bad answer to the problems we face. However as someone who has just joined the forums you have to understand that non healers don’t like being reliant on healers. 9/10 non healer mains are totally happy to die to the first mechanic of the boss and watch the WAR solo the boss from 95% HP.

If you have two opposing ways to fix a class and only one non healer mains are liable to support that’s the one I’m going to put my money behind. I also want more engaging healing but first and foremost I simply want the classes fixed to a reasonable level

If you are so confident in your assessment that most of the current ideas are terrible then why don’t you provide some of your own. What else do you physically want us to do, we say we don’t like the healers we get told to offer solutions, we do and get told they are garbage, we abandon the role and get called out on that as well

If your entire point is “your solutions are garbage no I will not elaborate or actually add to the discussion” I have no idea what you hope to achieve

[IDontPetLalas]

You started this conversation referring to "extensive" and "detailed" suggestions and in that response and every response since, you've not provided a single link or said which suggestions you consider to be "extensive".

A large majority of these suggestions believe that part of the issue in healers is that their Damage rotation is not engaging, they believe that because most of our time is spent doing damage it should be engaging to do so. Yet, these same individuals admit that damage is a "filler" to healing. The real issue is that healing is simply oversaturated, in easy content the damage does not justify the healing we have and in difficult content we're given two healers where one could suffice meaning that almost all healers who are worth their salt will be spending all GCD on damage and oGCD on healing. The solution isn't to continue spending all GCD's on damage but in a more engaging way, it is to actually make healing required.

Now, please — I doubt your next response will reference any of these 'detailed' and 'extensive' suggestions but I hope you prove me wrong and actually give us something to discuss.

First of all, thank you now for providing your feedback. I would state your remarks have been covered in much more detail in literally hundreds of posts, and I did in fact post a link to the specific sub-forum. Try checking the previous page again.

I (and many other) healers participated in those discussions for years. I have every confidence that you can find those threads if you are so interested, and a Google search would also likely pull up at least one in which we exceeded 100 pages. Snow might recall that one. However, I would say the onus is now on you.

[flowerkatie]

and I did in fact post a link to the specific sub-forum.

The majority of posts in this sub-forum are neither detailed or extensive and they swing from multiple sides of the debate, some are just complaints about cosmetics. The original post you responded to states "I'm OK with any solution." and your response was that any solution isn't fine, there are detailed and extensive solutions that are (by implication) fine. Linking an entire forum section that has no continuity between suggestions doesn't serve as backing your point up.

However, at this point I'm not surprised you didn't reference anything but ask me to.

[IDontPetLalas]

The majority of posts in this sub-forum are neither detailed or extensive and they swing from multiple sides of the debate, some are just complaints about cosmetics. The original post you responded to states "I'm OK with any solution." and your response was that any solution isn't fine, there are detailed and extensive solutions that are (by implication) fine. Linking an entire forum section that has no continuity between suggestions doesn't serve as backing your point up.

However, at this point I'm not surprised you didn't reference anything but ask me to.

That's fine, I understand. Someone who has been here for a while and interacted with multiple people concerning the healer role (in this case, myself) states that there are conversations relevant to this conversation that you (a newcomer) is likely unaware of, stretching past literally years.

You come back in less than 5 minutes and state that the posts in the healer sub-forum "have no continuity between suggestions". Well, you shouldn't be surprised that I ask for your position. That's genuinely amusing. You're either the world's best speed-reader, or you really have little interest in this topic.

[flowerkatie]

You come back in less than 5 minutes and state that the posts in the healer sub-forum "have no continuity between suggestions". Well, you shouldn't be surprised that I ask for your position. That's genuinely amusing. You're either the world's best speed-reader, or you really have little interest in this topic.

Ah yes, because before posting here I've absolutely never read that sub-form, I don't already have responses in that sub-forum and haven't engaged in it at all. The fact you completely failed to see the possibility that I might have already been active in and read many posts over the past few weeks in the forum is the only thing amusing.

and not actually looking in the healer forum

I mean, need I respond to this more than my above response on this message. Lmao.

[IDontPetLalas]

Ah yes, because before posting here I've absolutely never read that sub-form, I don't already have responses in that sub-forum and haven't engaged in it at all. The fact you completely failed to see the possibility that I might have already been active in and read many posts over the past few weeks in the forum is the only thing amusing.

I mean, need I respond to this more than my above response on this message. Lmao.

If you did, then you should be able to find the posts I referenced and add more detail to the discussion, which is point of this thread, if you can offer a fresh viewpoint I would genuinely welcome it.
i have not as yet seen that from you in the healer sub-forums (as you have very few posts), as we've spent more attention here, only recently.