We Really Need To Talk About The State And Path Of FFXIV

[Lorgana]

Okay but you understand that much like that other guy who didn't want to do anything but craft, when you gripe about the existing system despite having apparently made no concerted effort to work within it, it makes you look just a tiny bit foolish. And if you only made it to O2S last tier before quitting then it further enforces the idea that the reason you have this gripe is that you aren't able to actually clear the content.

You've brought up some good points in this thread after we moved away from the autism storm that was the raid discussion so I suggest we just shimmy away from that again because it looks like we are sneaking back that way.

[Magic-Mal]

Okay but you understand that much like that other guy who didn't want to do anything but craft, when you gripe about the existing system despite having apparently made no concerted effort to work within it, it makes you look just a tiny bit foolish. And if you only made it to O2S last tier before quitting then it further enforces the idea that the reason you have this gripe is that you aren't able to actually clear the content.

You've brought up some good points in this thread after we moved away from the autism storm that was the raid discussion so I suggest we just shimmy away from that again because it looks like we are sneaking back that way.

Sure. But you know I can't just let you say those things about me right? :P

I didn't quit raids I took a break from the game entirely. I was raiding and PvPing. After I got tired of everything(Mostly PvP), I decided I might as well take a break. Plus Monster Hunter was coming in a few months by then so it was a great time to take a break. I clearly stated that the difficulty of the raids(They're actually not really hard) had nothing to do with me not wanting to play them anymore as I have beaten harder things in this game. It had more to do with me disliking the loot system and lack of other gear options after I did O2S 12 times and never won loot.

I'm just trying to make everything about me as clear as possible so all of the false stuff is laid to rest. Because I am definitely not like the other person..

[TaiyoShikasu]

snip

Take first pair of gloves. Put them in the saddlebag, retainers inventory or equip them to retainer if able.

Buy second pair.

[Miste]

Remember I said the OP was made up of gripes I've held for a long time. Meaning that I was complaining about how the game has not changed since Creator, since Deltascape, since Sigmascape

Well, I am pretty sure Moro was specifically talking about how you blamed raids and raiders for all your issues with gear, and how you claimed you want BiS, yet you didn't meld the proper BiS stats for your job.

It confused me when I saw it too, and it likely confused her as well. Like, you said BiS was important to you multiple times and you are sitting there melding non-BiS materia. I'm sorry, but it was very confusing to see that.

You are just doing it for now because you are waiting till next tier then? Skill speed is bad for BRD right now, next tier likely won't change that, so if you want more damage going into 4.4 I would suggest changing it. Unless you are planning on buying a full set of the new crafted gear.

I still don't see how it is raids and raider's fault the game hasn't changed since Creator though, since that is part of your OP too. Have you changed your mind on that?

Minus flying and the raids section you have some good points in your OP, but you are likely missing quite a bit more support since you chose to alienate a subset of the community with misinformation, and misplaced blame.

[Magic-Mal]

Take first pair of gloves. Put them in the saddlebag, retainers inventory or equip them to retainer if able.

Buy second pair.

But I repeatedly switch between BRD and MCH. Why go through all that trouble over and over again for something so simple?

[HyoMinPark]

And lastly, I have skill speed because I like mashing buttons fast. I already broke a D-pad.

That doesn't change that skill speed is horrible on a BRD, and will cause GCD clipping. If you're playing it properly, you already spend a lot of time double-weaving in 2/3 of your songs, and, if you have high-enough Crit to proc both of your DoTs fast enough, most of your time in AP should be spent at 3- or 4-stacks (+12% or +16% haste). Is that not fast enough? I personally hate it because each clipped GCD is less damage overall.

You do realize that, unless you actually get enough Skill Speed to reach the next GCD tier, each and every point after your current threshold is worthless, yes? For example, the High Crit and 2x Tomestone ring builds for BRD put us at 983 Skill Speed; that's a 2.40 second GCD (threshold for 2.40 GCD is 982 Skill Speed). The next tier above that - 2.39 GCD - requires 1049 skill speed. If you sit at 1048, you still have a 2.40 GCD, and those 65 points of Skill Speed are worthless. You don't go any faster.

If you're adamant about having BiS or BiS equivalent, you don't blatantly meld suboptimal stats on to it. That's the opposite of BiS... I guess if you want to clip, then you do you... but it's suboptimal for the job. There's no changing that.



As for your gripe about O2S and not winning loot: why didn't you buy the loot you wanted with the pages you received? 12 books is 2 pieces of gear - head, gloves, or boots. If BRD is your main, buy gear with your pages. I'd have to double check my gearset, but I know the headpiece that tier was BiS, and I'm fairly certain the boots were, too. Voila! Two pieces of BiS. That's the purpose of you getting a page each clear - in the event you don't get the piece you need, after a few weeks you can buy it. Sure there as aspects of the page system that could be worked upon, but it's much better than Coil, where if you didn't receive your loot as a drop, you were completely SOL until the next week, or the next, or the next.

It’s not the best situation, but I’ll take waiting and buying gear with pages over not having a system like it at all. I had to buy most of my gear in both Deltascape and Sigmascape with books thanks to RNG. Sure, I couldn’t use them on off-classes, but since I don’t play them nearly as much as I do BRD, the i360 gear is more than enough for them. Only reason I would need i370 is if I got real ballsy suddenly and decided to learn how to heal UwU—which isn’t on my list of things I want to do at the moment (maybe at a later date though).

I'm with both Moro and Miste in that I feel your blaming of raiders and raids are misplaced with regards to your personal gear progression. Whether or not this was your intent, I don't know, but it's certainly came off that way as this thread progressed. I understand wanting to only do content with friends (I started the game very much like that), but if your progression stagnates because they are busy/aren’t logging in/etc., that’s not the fault of the game or raiders either. Not trying to argue; I’m just saying.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Sure. But you know I can't just let you say those things about me right? :P

I didn't quit raids I took a break from the game entirely. I was raiding and PvPing. After I got tired of everything(Mostly PvP), I decided I might as well take a break. Plus Monster Hunter was coming in a few months by then so it was a great time to take a break. I clearly stated that the difficulty of the raids(They're actually not really hard) had nothing to do with me not wanting to play them anymore as I have beaten harder things in this game. It had more to do with me disliking the loot system and lack of other gear options after I did O2S 12 times and never won loot.

I'm just trying to make everything about me as clear as possible so all of the false stuff is laid to rest. Because I am definitely not like the other person..

Why didn't you kill O4N each week? It only takes seven weeks to obtain the same token you waited twelve for. This just adds credence to Lorgana's argument. You aren't actively taking advantage of the systems in place, but merely complaining about them. I won't deny there could be improvements made, but when you aren't even bothering to use what's there, your complaints ring a tad hollow.

[Ruf]

Why didn't you kill O4N each week? It only takes seven weeks to obtain the same token you waited twelve for. This just adds credence to Lorgana's argument. You aren't actively taking advantage of the systems in place, but merely complaining about them. I won't deny there could be improvements made, but when you aren't even bothering to use what's there, your complaints ring a tad hollow.

While I disapprove with fast pace obsolescence gears, I must admit that I agree with Bourne_Endeavor on that one, and that is applying to a lot of players.

[Magic-Mal]

I'll try to answer all 3 in one.

Well, I am pretty sure Moro was specifically talking about how you blamed raids and raiders for all your issues with gear, and how you claimed you want BiS, yet you didn't meld the proper BiS stats for your job.

It confused me when I saw it too, and it likely confused her as well. Like, you said BiS was important to you multiple times and you are sitting there melding non-BiS materia. I'm sorry, but it was very confusing to see that.

You are just doing it for now because you are waiting till next tier then? Skill speed is bad for BRD right now, next tier likely won't change that, so if you want more damage going into 4.4 I would suggest changing it. Unless you are planning on buying a full set of the new crafted gear.

Okay to be 100% serious for once, I really didn't know the stats changed and no one told me so. Was joking around with the button-pressing stuff. Never had any raider friends in SB. Back in HW Skill Speed was better than Determination so I just followed that. Even knowing now that Determination is actually better it still doesn't change my desire for perfect BiS through different gear sets. I just focus my attention on a different 3rd stat.

That doesn't change that skill speed is horrible on a BRD, and will cause GCD clipping. If you're playing it properly, you already spend a lot of time double-weaving in 2/3 of your songs, and, if you have high-enough Crit to proc both of your DoTs fast enough, most of your time in AP should be spent at 3- or 4-stacks (+12% or +16% haste). Is that not fast enough? I personally hate it because each clipped GCD is less damage overall.

You do realize that, unless you actually get enough Skill Speed to reach the next GCD tier, each and every point after your current threshold is worthless, yes? For example, the High Crit and 2x Tomestone ring builds for BRD put us at 983 Skill Speed; that's a 2.40 second GCD (threshold for 2.40 GCD is 982 Skill Speed). The next tier above that - 2.39 GCD - requires 1049 skill speed. If you sit at 1048, you still have a 2.40 GCD, and those 65 points of Skill Speed are worthless. You don't go any faster.

If you're adamant about having BiS or BiS equivalent, you don't blatantly meld suboptimal stats on to it. That's the opposite of BiS... I guess if you want to clip, then you do you... but it's suboptimal for the job. There's no changing that.

I did notice things like Pitch Perfect can clip a little into the GCDs but I didn't think it was game-breaking because as I said to Miste, I didn't know the stats changed. I wasn't blatantly melding wrong. I was unknowingly though, as I find out now.

2.40 and that's the limit? Well, just going to say, you can definitely go faster... You just need uh, a lot more than 982.

As for your gripe about O2S and not winning loot: why didn't you buy the loot you wanted with the pages you received? 12 books is 2 pieces of gear - head, gloves, or boots. If BRD is your main, buy gear with your pages. I'd have to double check my gearset, but I know the headpiece that tier was BiS, and I'm fairly certain the boots were, too. Voila! Two pieces of BiS. That's the purpose of you getting a page each clear - in the event you don't get the piece you need, after a few weeks you can buy it. Sure there as aspects of the page system that could be worked upon, but it's much better than Coil, where if you didn't receive your loot as a drop, you were completely SOL until the next week, or the next, or the next.

It’s not the best situation, but I’ll take waiting and buying gear with pages over not having a system like it at all. I had to buy most of my gear in both Deltascape and Sigmascape with books thanks to RNG. Sure, I couldn’t use them on off-classes, but since I don’t play them nearly as much as I do BRD, the i360 gear is more than enough for them. Only reason I would need i370 is if I got real ballsy suddenly and decided to learn how to heal UwU—which isn’t on my list of things I want to do at the moment (maybe at a later date though).

Oh I did buy stuff. BRD is still wearing the hat. I actually got those very boots and my MCH wears them now. My SMN has O2S boots too. I can't remember which jewelry pieces they have but both have either hand-me-downs from BRD or what ever I got from extra books. Regardless I still can't stand the system. That's why I'm here!

I'm with both Moro and Miste in that I feel your blaming of raiders and raids are misplaced with regards to your personal gear progression. Whether or not this was your intent, I don't know, but it's certainly came off that way as this thread progressed. I understand wanting to only do content with friends (I started the game very much like that), but if your progression stagnates because they are busy/aren’t logging in/etc., that’s not the fault of the game or raiders either. Not trying to argue; I’m just saying.

I guess I'll try to explain better now that it's no longer heated. I never hated raiders or blames raiders for anything directly except for the change to the Diadem stuff. I was actually blaming raids mostly and in that, blaming the devs.

The devs balance everything to be below i370(soon to be i400) without any other kind of options "because raids" -> When we did have an exception happen raiders complained(not saying you complained). And gear drops were nerfed and ilvl was nerfed to i205. This is when I included blame on the raiders. -> after that everything stagnated in my eyes, even when I was raiding myself. Because I still wanted to see other things that gave gear -> I believe at least, that now Yoshida is afraid to make any changes because he doesn't want to upset anyone anymore -> I make that section of the OP. -> Fire -> We're here!

Why didn't you kill O4N each week? It only takes seven weeks to obtain the same token you waited twelve for. This just adds credence to Lorgana's argument. You aren't actively taking advantage of the systems in place, but merely complaining about them. I won't deny there could be improvements made, but when you aren't even bothering to use what's there, your complaints ring a tad hollow.

Good question. I had to think for a few minutes why I didn't and I think it was literally because it had determination on it. YES I know Weapon Damage is what matters but I'm very stubborn when it comes to secondary stats and it's not the first time I've been told. Of course at that time I didn't know that Determination was actually good. I ended up buying the MCH weapon instead.

I think because there were no weapons with stats I wanted I just stopped playing PvE stuff completely, including raids and went back to PvP again, got bored, and took an 8 month break. Came back and saw the Tsukuyomi Bow and had plans for that until I remembered I had an i320 weapon. Then I saw the tome bow and realized that was better and alot easier to get. Is that all stupid? I bet it is. But I would still like more options.

[Miste]

Okay to be 100% serious for once, I really didn't know the stats changed and no one told me so. Was joking around with the button-pressing stuff. Never had any raider friends in SB. Back in HW Skill Speed was better than Determination so I just followed that. Even knowing now that Determination is actually better it still doesn't change my desire for perfect BiS through different gear sets. I just focus my attention on a different 3rd stat.

Ah okay, well just remember expansions change things so keep an eye on guides for BiS and stuff if you wanna try for it.

The devs balance everything to be below i370(soon to be i400) without any other kind of options "because raids" -> When we did have an exception happen raiders complained(not saying you complained). And gear drops were nerfed and ilvl was nerfed to i205. This is when I included blame on the raiders. -> after that everything stagnated in my eyes, even when I was raiding myself. Because I still wanted to see other things that gave gear -> I believe at least, that now Yoshida is afraid to make any changes because he doesn't want to upset anyone anymore -> I make that section of the OP. -> Fire -> We're here!

There is a problem with this though, the problem being is the diadem information in your OP is incorrect.

Diadem 1.0 was never nerfed. Some raiders complained, yes, but the gear stayed i210 (same item level as the savage gear at the time). So SE ignored the raider complaints.

Even Diadem 2.0 they added a weapon better than savage one, it was i280 when savage was i275, if SE was really listening to raider complaints why did they do the same exact thing twice? (and this time it wasn't even just the same item level, it was higher!)

It makes no sense.

The majority of players complaining about that i280 weapon was actually relic grinders because the relic had only been completed to i275 nine days before them adding this i280 weapon, some raiders might have complained too, but relic definitely seemed to be the main sticking point and majority issue since it took people a long grind investment only for it to be beaten 9 days after finally completing it.

As I said to another poster in this thread. You cannot claim diadem didn't come back after the end of HW all because of raiders, since raiders were not the only community of players who complained about diadem. All types of players had criticism about diadem as a whole. The general community consensus that I saw at the time was Diadem was not good content, and in my opinion it wasn't, not because of the gear, simply the content itself.

So unless you can prove diadem was taken away from us solely due to raiders complaining about the gear in it back in 3.1, with some kind of statement from SE to confirm it, then you shouldn't be using this as a reason to be upset at raiders and/or blame them for things.