Consolidated White Mage 4.0 Feedback Thread

[Mahkii]

we goin in hard?!! You know there isn't just like a button they press and make pld blocking ability start blocking magic....stuff like that require and overhaul of the system...hence 4.0.. There is only so much tweaking you can do in any particular system. Besides that PLD can clear any content in game, whether or not pld is most optimal for the content is a different story......and lastly Yoshi just said going into Heaven's they spent a shit ton of time trying to get DRK into the mix, which would explain why everything wasn't balanced and now they're hoping to address tank balancing in SB.



Yoshida: That said, sometimes when I'm participating in instanced dungeons, I'll queue as tank or healer because the matchmaking is so fast, but in the case of healer, although attacking itself isn't hard, I feel that the stance switching narrows the field of players who are interested in healing. When looking at the data, even though many players have healers at the appropriate job level, they won't be participating as healer. When considering the reasons for this, it seems that there are two main ones - it's too much work, and being asked to DPS.



Either he's lying....... or it's like I've been saying..... the nominal healing community isn't even comfortable with the "rigors" of dpsing in a dung?? What makes you think they ready for a more dynamic WHM healer that ups party dps thru a new complex system?? These chants of make "WHM" great again is coming from the top 1% of you.... not the masses. The masses seem to be saying "Keep WHM EZ again !"

That's unfortunate for the future of WHM.

[Exiled_Tonberry]

/sigh

It's extremely obvious that he's either disconnected with healers who raid (or healers who just like fun, engaging job spells for that matter) and really doesn't know what we want or need, or even worse, thinks that the current healers are even marginally balanced.
Perhaps AST and SCH is, but WHM is several levels below them. How am I supposed throw praises at the guy when things are this bad? 3.0 AST I get. They were afraid of making it too strong (which in the end they did, anyway). This is on a whole new level though. It's not even CLOSE to being balanced.

And please don't get me that excuse about WHM remaining simple because it's an iconic job. So is samurai, and they're the hardest job yet. So is DRG, and it's remained one of the tougher melee jobs to handle. There's no excuse for WHM to be so behind.
Honestly a red flag should have went up when he talked about hating Cleric Stance, despite being a extremely important part of a raiding healer.

You know what it feels like? It feels Yoshi's making WHM into his little vision of what a healer should look like, while making the others what healers NEED to be like in this game. I know that's probably way off, but it's just how I see it.

[Exiled_Tonberry]

I dunno where you guys got the info that earthly star is 30y but it is definitely not. To be accurate, the media tour tooltip listed the ability with a radius of 1y which is obvioulsy an error but people who got to play it said it is 10y.

It starts off at 10y, and expands to 30y after 10 seconds.

[Cynfael]

You know what it feels like? It feels Yoshi's making WHM into his little vision of what a healer should look like, while making the others what healers NEED to be like in this game. I know that's probably way off, but it's just how I see it.

Slight detour from the previous topic, but while I admire Yoshi for the work he's done in revamping and elevating FFXIV as a whole, everyone would do well to take his comments with a grain of salt. The man's job is to make sure FFXIV is successful, not to execute personally every role on his development team. He's also entitled to his own opinions, just as the players are entitled to theirs and will continue to do whatever they want within the parameters of the game.

For example, when Yoshi says he doesn't consider healer DPS to be mandatory, he's playing it smart by not antagonizing the customers who enjoy the game one way and who are unlikely to change. Those of us who believe that the choice not to DPS at all as a healer is a selfish and lazy one will wink at him and keep doing what we're doing. It's a win-win from the customer service side of things.

[Feidam]

Except with the change to damage coming off of mind cleric stance is essentially on all the time now. A change especially beneficial to assize. I agree the whm needed some help but let's not act like something's are problems when they are not. Furthermore we already know that they have at least heard the complaints and are looking into things. I think all the complaints can stop now and wait to see what they do. Then after seeing what they did you can start anew if needed.

[javid]

It's extremely obvious that he's either disconnected with healers who raid (or healers who just like fun, engaging job spells for that matter) and really doesn't know what we want or need, or even worse, thinks that the current healers are even marginally balanced.
Perhaps AST and SCH is, but WHM is several levels below them.

....he doesnt just have the hardcore players to please...did you miss the part that showed data that the masses have healers lvled but they wont play the healer role b/c its too complicated to heal/dps or they find it cumbersome (THINGS I'VE REPEATEDLY SAID......) Doesn't seem disconnected at all.

Whm= causal
ast/sch= pro

something for everybody, but some ppl want everything for themselves....

[javid]

snip

Agreed with you! But to Tonberry point; bc Yoshi doesn't think healer NEED to dps; Yoshi has purposefully tuned the raids to require 0 healer dps. Meaning all healer dps is bonus for the party meeting dps checks! (some ppl find that a good thing like me! Others are mad and want healer dps to be required in the dps checks.... like maybe Tonberry).

How do you please the hardcore players and causal players?? YOU give them each a few bones is how!! Take your SCH/AST and leave the causal his WHM....why is that such a problem for some of you?? lool.

Actually he said that while learning raid content healers will probably have to add dps. He said that the 4 man casual content is designed without the need for healers to dps.

Link provided in which interview he did say healer dps isn't mandatory

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...aler-to-DPS%21

Why is one job out of 13 in the game designated as "casual" and deserves to not have any helpful or strong mechanics for itself?
If that's actually true, it's a very stupid move on Yoshi's part, to be blunt about it.

And creating interesting and fun mechanics isn't only catering to hardcore players. I'm sure casual players would love a fun system on their WHM that rewards them and makes them feel powerful. If anything, this lily system will turn more players off of WHM rather then draw them in. No one wants to sit around playing with RNG, and CD reduction is very BORING.

Casual doesn't have to mean boring or weak.

It's actually not just one job if you think about it. If we sat down right now we could breakdown our current job system into top tier jobs vs mid tier; in terms of ceiling level and player skill required to master them. Easy current example

MCH........ vs DRG (drg's only saving grace is its piercing dmg it gives brd; that lil BL is cute but that alone would not keep it in comp if not for piercing)


And Causal doesnt have to mean boring or weak is your take on what options he's presented to the FFXIV community! Not to say your thoughts DONT MATTER. But I'm saying that he is saying THERE ARE EVEN MORE THOUGHTS THAT SAY DIFFERENTLY, than you and those like you.

Because some people love the job WHM and has raided with it since 2.0.
Because some people find it unfair that WHM has suddenly been designated "casual" by Yoshi and is now stuck at the low end of the stick until perhaps 5.0.

Honestly if I can't play WHM without feeling like I'm severely handicapping my raid, I'm quitting healing. I enjoy WHM, and I want to play WHM, but it's obvious their vision for the job is crippling it.

Again those are your definitions... which are find for you and those that think like you do; but the MASSES...... (I think you're ignoring this common theme) Want stuff for them too! Also consider the argument "why WHM?"; they could have done this to any or even many of the classes and some other guy would say just what your'e saying "Why Sch? Why PLd? WHY mnk? why blah blah blah?" And SE would respond "why not?" the masses by in large pay the bill so the masses by and large must be pleased first! If you wanna be mad at anyone be mad at the masses that can't handle difficult rotations and monitoring several cds at once!! (I know I give all subpar dps in dung hell.....and I'm probably on several blists b/c I think if you wanna play then you should put in the effort to play WELL.) I'm also the kind of player to run in a dung and see a tank in max ilv 270 gear in tank stance, doing single target combos on a multi add pull and I'm tempted to ragequit and try again in 30min...... I know I need help....

Stating that Yoshi has purposefully tuned the raids to require 0 healer DPS may be a bit misleading. It's more accurate to say that the raid DPS checks are tuned specifically with minimum Tank and DPS role contributions taken into account (excepting the Healer role).

It's a small distinction, but I believe that it's an important one. The first statement implies to me that healers should consider themselves exempt from any contribution beyond basic healing, so sayeth the Yoshida. The second statement acknowledges that the math in raid design deliberately doesn't account for healers, leaving it up to individual parties and players to determine the optimal degree of healer DPS participation.

Agreed! That's why I see it as a bonus IF a good healer can also dps while sustaining the party MAKES the fight that much easier!

[Feidam]

Agreed with you! But to Tonberry point; bc Yoshi doesn't think healer NEED to dps; Yoshi has purposefully tuned the raids to require 0 healer dps. Meaning all healer dps is bonus for the party meeting dps checks! (some ppl find that a good thing like me! Others are mad and want healer dps to be required in the dps checks.... like maybe Tonberry).

Actually he said that while learning raid content healers will probably have to add dps. He said that the 4 man casual content is designed without the need for healers to dps.

[Medeah]

It starts off at 10y, and expands to 30y after 10 seconds.

Would you mind elaborating on where you found this information? I am sorry, I am not trying to be rude, but I've seen it being used in a dungeon video and the radius is definitely not 30y after 10s. 30y would be larger than a medica II. You can tell by the animation that this is not the case.

The tooltips make no mention of an expanded radius after 10s either. Although I'll agree that those are crippled with errors. It does list a range of 30y but range and radius are 2 different things.

[Exiled_Tonberry]

, but some ppl want everything for themselves....

Why is one job out of 13 in the game designated as "casual" and deserves to not have any helpful or strong mechanics for itself?
If that's actually true, it's a very stupid move on Yoshi's part, to be blunt about it.

And creating interesting and fun mechanics isn't only catering to hardcore players. I'm sure casual players would love a fun system on their WHM that rewards them and makes them feel powerful. If anything, this lily system will turn more players off of WHM rather then draw them in. No one wants to sit around playing with RNG, and CD reduction is very BORING.

Casual doesn't have to mean boring or weak.