Consolidated White Mage 4.0 Feedback Thread

[Exiled_Tonberry]

clueless troll!

You're not even attempting to understand where us WHM mains are coming from.
You read what we say (maybe) and the instantly retaliate with your "you're not the 1% who cares stop playing WHM!" argument.

There really is something wrong with WHM and the lily system, both in its fun factor and balance between both other healers.
There was a noticeable gap in power, but now it's more apparent than ever.
You don't need to raid or to be a hardcore gamer to see how extremely weak the job is right now. It's to the point that bringing it into the raid is a handicap, and that is just an awful feeling. It must've felt something like this with Dragoons in 2.0, but at least they did decent damage to pull their own weight.

Of course, you'll just ignore all of this and scream quit WHM or say "it's still viable" so \o/

[fantasticm]

Man you're out of touch.... but I can tell by the way you parsed my words in order to make erroneous points, that I'd be wasting time going point by point with you.... I'll just take the lost! You're right! I'm the clueless troll! NO, the stupid, clueless troll!

You've already been wasting your time. One would think by now you'd realize that the concerns people have with WHM aren't limited to 'the top 1% core raiders' but whatever I guess. I won't argue that last bit, though.

[Licicic]

(snip) if you really dont like the implementations in content....don't play it;.

WHM is the only job I've tried that satisfies me. If they go through with the teased changes I will likely not enjoy the game any more.

I'm not a top tier raider, but I am a lower to mid tier one. I still think the people who aren't interested in this content matter. WHM will have the few parts of it's unique kit given to the other healers and in return only gets gated chance based procs with minimal returns in an actual fight. This poorly effects anyone interested in WHM regardless of the level of play as you can get better healing ability plus utilities from the other healers where WHM has none.

TLDR; Everyone matters. Those looking for relaxed play would have a better time with a more powerful healer. Those looking for raid need utility.

[KingFrost]

Why is one job out of 13 in the game designated as "casual" and deserves to not have any helpful or strong mechanics for itself?
If that's actually true, it's a very stupid move on Yoshi's part, to be blunt about it.

And creating interesting and fun mechanics isn't only catering to hardcore players. I'm sure casual players would love a fun system on their WHM that rewards them and makes them feel powerful. If anything, this lily system will turn more players off of WHM rather then draw them in. No one wants to sit around playing with RNG, and CD reduction is very BORING.

Casual doesn't have to mean boring or weak.

As someone​ who is decidedly a casual player, I'd love the WHM to get more utility and buffs available to the party. I've been listing ideas left and right not because I want an OD character or "Have it all," it's because I'd find them fun. I love the aesthetics and lore of the class, and would like to play it and not feel clunkily designed or "weak" relative to other healers in a group.

[OcieKo]

Yoshida Interview excerpt

Since things are more serious in raiding, on the other hand, you'll definitely want to DPS for the first clear. As item levels go up and you're after repeat clears, the roles may shift. (laughs)

I get the feeling, people aren't connecting with the point of this line. Pretty sure by "first clear" he means week 1-3 of raids where your gear is literally below the design of running the raid smoothly. Which after a few weeks of tome and turn in farming, a groups DPS should be on par with the expected tank sticking to mitigation, healer to healing, DPS to DPS. But hes still acknowledging that day 1 of savage, its going to be tightroping the dps check that way. So that extra bit of healer dps can make it easier to be on the far side of it. But after its in full swing, its just clear speed not wipe or win. World/Data Center/Server firsts, not "newbie" firsts.

sorry i was thinking of something else, just went and looked at the newest tooltip or whatever, it's a very short CD

trying to think what was 35s, but looking...i just can't figure it out now. maybe it was on another class i'm looking into the tooltips about...

Thanks for finding the tooltip. Yep this makes it a bit easier to use at a decent time rather than blow it right away unlike the 35s misassociation. Doesnt really change the acquisition timer, but makes it easier to use. 7 more days til the fog of war clears... Either way its CD is still a min of 30s since its about the fastest you can flip in cards.

[Saraphin]

I get the feeling, people aren't connecting with the point of this line. Pretty sure by "first clear" he means week 1-3 of raids where your gear is literally below the design of running the raid smoothly. Which after a few weeks of tome and turn in farming, a groups DPS should be on par with the expected tank sticking to mitigation, healer to healing, DPS to DPS. But hes still acknowledging that day 1 of savage, its going to be tightroping the dps check that way. So that extra bit of healer dps can make it easier to be on the far side of it. But after its in full swing, its just clear speed not wipe or win. World/Data Center/Server firsts, not "newbie" firsts.



Thanks for finding the tooltip. Yep this makes it a bit easier to use at a decent time rather than blow it right away unlike the 35s misassociation. Doesnt really change the acquisition timer, but makes it easier to use. 7 more days til the fog of war clears... Either way its CD is still a min of 30s since its about the fastest you can flip in cards.

Yeah, i'm burning on fumes from doing an addition to my actual house. i know some job has a new 35s timer...but for the life of me, too tired to really associate it.

this does however, put a lot of power in the AST hands (not that i'm against Jobs having unique things...but...this seems a bit too much. every draw they can have a burst of DPS or some healing: ie Tank busters) but...i don't think this should come at the costs of the players of WHMs and the players of SCHs to an extent..

I know, realistically, it's going to be used 2 times a minute, but it just...seems a bit much. a bit Shiny new Toy that Makes it so there are no bad cards but can all be really good cards and yes, i'm aware that ALL cards can have some use, but with Arrow and...something else (again wiped out tired right now) being now given an auto spread...it's looking more like they're getting a lot more buffs than they need at this point.

[OcieKo]

i know some job has a new 35s timer...but for the life of me, too tired to really associate it.

this does however, put a lot of power in the AST hands (not that i'm against Jobs having unique things...but...this seems a bit too much. every draw they can have a burst of DPS or some healing: ie Tank busters) but...i don't think this should come at the costs of the players of WHMs and the players of SCHs to an extent..

I know, realistically, it's going to be used 2 times a minute, but it just...seems a bit much. a bit Shiny new Toy that Makes it so there are no bad cards but can all be really good cards and yes, i'm aware that ALL cards can have some use, but with Arrow and...something else being now given an auto spread...it's looking more like they're getting a lot more buffs than they need at this point.

Im still awaiting something more concrete on the base aoe card effects, tho i agree its rediculous if its true. Tho part of getting 2 chances of lord lady per minute, it also means were failing to set up any buff utility for 1 minute. Either way this technically pans out weaker than what I wanted to fix the 2 cds for no gain issue, which was control over Royal Roads activation, but seems interesting, so next week ill play with and make an opinion on it. Unlike some people here i wont complain about a layer of RNG and having to use single target heals, or complain that being able to use my CDs more often is undesirable. Now we just need a 25% RNG Mechanic on AST and well have a full set from out of 2 to out of 6. (Draw 1/6, Redraw 1/5, Royal Road 1/3, Minor Arcana 1/2, awaiting 1/4).

There never have been bad cards, just more expensive to use ones. In comparison to WHM like this forum is about, itd be like having to click off Presence of Mind intentionally so you could use Asylum earlier. Tho in our case we usually throw away defense, power replenishment, cooldowns, and speed just to give people what they want...
Sometimes i think AST would be more fun without royal road. Just spread and draw. One card to save for the right moment, one to put in the best spot now, this later point is near dead in current AST play. I like royal road and all, but it feels like it limits my choices more often than not. Don't get to use nearly enough Enhanced Boles, Extended Arrows, or Expanded Ewer/Spire, its always wtf wheres my balance, never oh sweet thanks for the TP... My crappy DPS Goadarai and Battery Likened Mage to the rescue (crappy DPS, because I personally suck at DPS, I OT and Heal for a reason). Also BLM acronym usage win, and yes I seriously plan on mastering the art of giving out MP/TP on the kings of Damage Per Hit type DPS jobs, cause I'll probably never get a pure support in games again.

[CaeliaCat]

I feel like this thread is being continuously derailed by AST apologists and attention seekers... many of whom don't have WHM at 60 (looking at you, Highlights) or haven't bothered playing the job outside of 4-person dungeons since they main a tank or something.

The bottom line: WHM needs some form raid utility to compete with AST and SCH in endgame content.

Take your pick! Lots of great suggestions in this thread.

-Direct hit buff for the party
-Haste
-Better shields (Graniteskin)
-Target defense down (Dia)
-Reraise
-Raise II (no weakness)

Honestly, just one single place where WHM could shine would mean a world of difference, even with a clunky, shoehorned lily system.

[OcieKo]

I feel like this thread is being continuously derailed by AST apologists and attention seekers... many of whom don't have WHM at 60 (looking at you, Highlights) or haven't bothered playing the job outside of 4-person dungeons since they main a tank or something.

I guessing I'm highlights. Ill have my 2nd 60 WHM this week. Unfortunately the forums only allow you to register 3 characters, so the 3 with multiple jobs are listed, i have 7 that have completed at least 3.0, one has NOTHING BUT a WHM on it. Yep, I'm that rare breed of player who has alts for more than just mules. If it helps PLD is my favorite tank, have 2 of those at 60 as well, prefer to OT, picking up adds and covering for the team (Divine Veil, Passage of Arms, and a heal /drool). 2 60 DRGs, BLMs, and CRPs as well, 1 of everything else at 60.

My constant co-healer plays SCH/WHM and usually covers most of the healing necessary, while I cover most of the support like, Cleanse, Rez, mechanics reminders, MP management, random target mechanic recovery like prey, or DPS. How she does it on SCH and sometimes Noct AST and make it looks easy, who knows, I prefer WHM/Diurnal AST for primarily taking over healing. And were not big fans of running D AST/N AST, not as fun and we boil down into having to flip roles, I do bulk she does spot, which quite frankly, were better the other way around.

Edit: my bad just checked, it 3 jobs per character, so Gidget is listed when looking at my profile. Ociela's should hit 59 tomorrow (later today) and 60 Saturday.
For the future, don't forget to use the resources you have available to verify things.

[Taika]

I get the feeling, people aren't connecting with the point of this line. Pretty sure by "first clear" he means week 1-3 of raids where your gear is literally below the design of running the raid smoothly.

It's a bit off topic, but I think "first clear" means different things for different groups: it may require healer DPS from the world first groups on the first few weeks, like you said. But from the "not-100%-optimal" groups it will require that for much longer, even with item level increase. The thing that doesn't make sense in that quote is that if you are able to DPS as a healer on your first clear in any content, the content won't get any harder than that, so you're supposed to DPS more on each following clear... Sorry about the off topic, that quote has been bothering me because it doesn't make much sense. :P