I'm bored when I heal because I need more complex DPS rotations

[ForteNightshade]

Might work if the sylphies weren’t also coincidentally the worst healers as well

I'll never forget a little experiment I did back in Heavensward. If my co-healer didn't turn on Cleric Stance within 20-30 seconds, I left them to solo heal the entire fight. A few exceptions were if I got paired with a new healer or it became clear they simply couldn't handle it. I didn't want to outright cause a wipe if I could step in and save the run.

The sheer amount of "sylphies" who were utterly clueless at how to actually heal was staggering. And this wasn't in Savage or even EX. Just normal mode Creator, 24 mans and the like. I had one person mouth off in chat, "Cassandra in her PvP gear just wants to DPS" after they ran out of MP (remember when that was a thing?) in the first phase of A12N because they literally spammed Medica II for everything. Fortunately, the DRK in that party called them out. Even nowadays, some eight years later and I get the "healer mains" upset I'm not healing enough. Had a healer in P11S ask if I'm "barsing" after she, the White Mage died to the raid just before everyone runs north. First, I had my oGCDs up and nobody else died. Secondly... when I looked at the logs, I noticed Assize was drifted all over the place. Guess what would have been up where she died if she pressed it properly?

[Conchoidal]

If they made healing requirement harder --> it would clense out the dps-healers
and we would actually get ppl decent/good at the role in our duties. ^o^

How would this improve the experience for healers once their item level is high enough to ignore mechanics or for MSQ/solo content? All this would accomplish is increasing queue times since fewer people would want to be held responsible for healing.

[Renathras]

Pot/kettle

No. And that's exactly the thing I'm talking about.

Moving on:

Who is what content for? Serious question. Extremes aren't to keep Savage raiders entertained, because that's impossible. Speaking of questions asked before without answer, I've asked that one: What level of DPS rotation WOULD IT TAKE to keep you entertained in current Extremes? The answer was crickets. Because I suspect we all know it would need to be something like BLM otherwise you're going to still end up bored. More DPS buttons masks the problem, it doesn't fix it. At the end of the day, you won't be entertained/not bored in Extremes unless you have something comparable to a DPSers rotation because there just aren't going to be enough mechanics for your SMN-lite rotation to be entertaining. 1-2 more DPS buttons, or even 3-5 likely won't help. Can you REALLY tell me that applying Dia every 12 seconds is going to make you not bored anymore? Especially when your AOE rotation will ignore it anyway in favor of Holyspam?

Given that, changes aren't being made to "dungeon bosses" to keep you entertained, since nothing will. So we aren't talking about dungeons. We're talking about Savage bosses and Extreme bosses.

As I've told you before - you just like to ignore things I've said to you that answer your question so you can act like it hasn't been answered as some kind of damning mic drop moment - actual changes would require a complete readjustment to the kits. Potency balancing and oGCD timer adjustments. So it wouldn't be "with our current kits".

You aren't "Still waiting on this one" because I've answered you on this before, probably multiple times. I've never dodged it and I DID give you exact numbers before.

So you aren't "Waiting for an answer to a simple question", since you got answers, you just handwaved them away or ignored them.

[Mithron]

If they made healing requirement harder --> it would clense out the dps-healers
and we would actually get ppl decent/good at the role in our duties. ^o^

No one wants to be a heal slave. You're free to go play MapleStory and Ragnarok Online if you want. Everyone wants to contribute to damage in meaningful ways.

[Sebazy]

No one wants to be a heal slave. You're free to go play MapleStory and Ragnarok Online if you want. Everyone wants to contribute to damage in meaningful ways.

In fairness, I disagree there. There are indeed a pretty substantial number of people who would prefer to actually be able to play the healbot. It’s just this game doesn’t really support that at any level in its current form.

IMO the compromise is buffing. But SE are too afraid/incapable of investing the time needed to get it right.

[Mithron]

In fairness, I disagree there. There are indeed a pretty substantial number of people who would prefer to actually be able to play the healbot. It’s just this game doesn’t really support that at any level in its current form.

IMO the compromise is buffing. But SE are too afraid/incapable of investing the time needed to get it right.

No, they only think they do. Then when they get it, they'll realize the fatigue and boredom (especially in non-relevant content) and quickly realize how wrong they were then beg to revert. Not to mention how the players willing to heal would drop that much more and waiting for healers would be obscenely longer.

[Renathras]

No, they only think they do. Then when they get it, they'll realize the fatigue and boredom (especially in non-relevant content) and quickly realize how wrong they were then beg to revert. Not to mention how the players willing to heal would drop that much more and waiting for healers would be obscenely longer.

No, Sebazy's right.

Not everyone actually enjoys DPSing. In games with four roles (Tank, Heal, DPS, Support), DPS makes up only around 30% of players, meaning around 2 out of 3 want to do something else. Many people pick Healers specifically because they like supporting and aiding allies and don't derive joy from big damage numbers nor satisfaction from executing a DPS rotation.

This is very much a "you think you do, but you don't" statement.

You may be correct that there are LESS people that want to be pure healers than the number of healers now, but the fact remains, there are genuinely people that would be content not dealing damage in group content. I remember in ARR being told that healers don't have MP for damage dealing, so only heal. Did that in tons of content and enjoyed it all just fine. I've also played games where healers couldn't deal damage for various reasons (generally MP), like Holy Priest and Resto Druid in BC and Wrath era WoW where you pretty much didn't hit an attack spell in group content (the whole "I'm going to WAND you to death!" meme was real for a reason), and people loved it. I loved it.

So you speak for yourself, not everyone, when you say "Everyone wants to contribute to damage in meaningful ways."

There are a lot of people who would be content only casting heals, and there are others who wouldn't, but would rather, as Sebazy says, contribute by buffing instead of damage dealing. This isn't saying there aren't people who want to deal damage and be kind of hybrid DPS/healers - there very clearly are - but not everyone "wants to contribute to damage".

[Zeastria]

How would this improve the experience for healers once their item level is high enough to ignore mechanics or for MSQ/solo content? All this would accomplish is increasing queue times since fewer people would want to be held responsible for healing.

Easy fix:

It should be % based
meaning even w better gear you should still take same amount of dmg..
also it should be more unavoidable damage and dots during fights ^^

If you can't press your heal buttons..
then i see no point why you should be playing healer in first place.

[Teno]

Easy fix:

It should be % based
meaning even w better gear you should still take same amount of dmg..
also it should be more unavoidable damage and dots during fights ^^

If you can't press your heal buttons..
then i see no point why you should be playing healer in first place.

Please just stop. What you propose has debunked 10000000 times ever since ARR (and even though there were more sources of damage back then). With its gcd and encounter design this game is NOT made for -reactive- heal bots. Stop with this bs that seemingly only comes from clueless people.

[Connor]

In fairness, I disagree there. There are indeed a pretty substantial number of people who would prefer to actually be able to play the healbot. It’s just this game doesn’t really support that at any level in its current form.

IMO the compromise is buffing. But SE are too afraid/incapable of investing the time needed to get it right.

I do! My favourite content to heal was The Feast as a Scholar, back when they removed the healer dps abilities but kept the damage amounts the same so it was a constant battle just to keep people alive on top of dealing with stuff like CC, or running around grabbing those bloody potions or the medals lol. I even actually had to use Physick! There was so much healing required that you’d just bottom out of MP really fast if you spammed Adloquium with abandon. It was one of the few times I ever felt like a ‘real healer’.

That said, naturally I don’t expect anything like that to ever manifest in ffxiv’s PvE lol, it would completely demolish the healer player-base with how much work it would required. It would be too much of a 180 from how content is currently, that it wouldn’t be fair to make it the norm.

But still, we (well, I) do exist! Just hiding in dark corners dreaming of things that will never be. I do agree that buffing is a very good compromise way, since it allows for a healer to contribute in more varied ways than just directly dealing damage to the enemy