5.08 Patch - DPS still not balanced.

[ForteNightshade]

I like how you think anyone pushing week 1 is slacking.

I didn't say they were. I said they can. At least relative to comparing comps running the big three in lieu of the rest. Please actually read my posts if you're going to reply.

[Kabooa]

I didn't say they were. I said they can. At least relative to comparing comps running the big three in lieu of the rest. Please actually read my posts if you're going to reply.

Lets flip this, and see how well these theoretical claims pan out.

You -can- clear week 1 without them.

So clearly anyone who didn't was just slacking. All of them. All of them.

Doesn't paint a very good light, does it?

[ForteNightshade]

Lets flip this, and see how well these theoretical claims pan out.

You -can- clear week 1 without them.

So clearly anyone who didn't was just slacking. All of them. All of them.

Doesn't paint a very good light, does it?

Since you want to argue pointless semantic and put words in my mouth. I'll rephrase. Certain comps have a significant advantage over others even if the skill level of the players in the weaker job comp is higher. Therefore, the comp running the big three could afford more mistakes and less optimal play—to the tune of 1,000+ per job.

Slacking means making mistakes in this context ><

Thank you!

[Kabooa]

Since you want to argue pointless semantic and put words in my mouth. I'll rephrase.

They aren't pointless.

Slacking doesn't mean 'make mistakes'. It means 'not put in as much effort as one could'. It creates a clear, intentional or not, message that doesn't serve the discussion at all. "THEY don't have to work as hard as YOU", which itself ignores the matter that you don't want that sort of player in your team, regardless of what job they're on.

[Dogempire]

They aren't pointless.

Slacking doesn't mean 'make mistakes'. It means 'not put in as much effort as one could'. It creates a clear, intentional or not, message that doesn't serve the discussion at all. "THEY don't have to work as hard as YOU", which itself ignores the matter that you don't want that sort of player in your team, regardless of what job they're on.

Except that people have different skill levels with this game, some people are able to easily pull 90th percentile dps on any job they want with minimal effort and only a bit of reading, while some have to work hard to be able to consistently pull dps above the 70th percentile, whether it be because you're new to mmos or because of age or even just because you don't have much talent for your job.

I've personally always been an advocate for "Play the job you're good at" because everyone has classes they suck at *cough* summoner *cough* but the issue that most people have when it comes to job balance is from the fact that a person who can perform at the 95th percentile on any job they choose but enjoys playing dancer or red mage the most and decides to main it for this savage tier is unintentionally putting a handicap on their group by not performing as well as they could at their dps percentile.

And by as well as they could, I mean that the 95th percentile red mage pulling 12.7k dps could be playing monk instead and pull a dps of 14,200 instead of a dps of 12.7k. That's a handicap of 1.5k on the group just because of job choice, and that handicap multiplies, scaling even higher with each lower end job that the group is running.

Obviously there will always be dps differences between jobs, and there will be some jobs that are much better than the others, but, a 1.5k rdps handicap should be from running 3 lower end jobs, not 1.

[Kabooa]

Obviously there will always be dps differences between jobs, and there will be some jobs that are much better than the others, but, a 1.5k rdps handicap should be from running 3 lower end jobs, not 1.

I said nothing about the overall state of balance, because I've said elsewhere plenty what I believe the direction they should take is..

[Dogempire]

I said nothing about the overall state of balance, because I've said elsewhere plenty what I believe the direction they should take is..

Yeah I kind of went off on a tangent there.

Regardless, my point was that the same level of effort yields different levels of results depending on what your class is as well as other factors you can't really control as easily.

Obviously you should always be trying your hardest when it comes to clearing content, but it's super discouraging that your 100% will yield much better results on a more overpowered job. There's nothing wrong with finding that fact discouraging or even a infuriating.

[whiskeybravo]

And by as well as they could, I mean that the 95th percentile red mage pulling 12.7k dps could be playing monk instead and pull a dps of 14,200 instead of a dps of 12.7k. That's a handicap of 1.5k on the group just because of job choice, and that handicap multiplies, scaling even higher with each lower end job that the group is running.

Unless.. (drumroll)

You already have a monk.

I would like to see the comparison between a 4 monk comp and a proper comp, though.

[Kabooa]

Unless.. (drumroll)

You already have a monk.

I would like to see the comparison between a 4 monk comp and a proper comp, though.

Very low Tank damage.

Obviously you should always be trying your hardest when it comes to clearing content, but it's super discouraging that your 100% will yield much better results on a more overpowered job. There's nothing wrong with finding that fact discouraging or even a infuriating.

Yeah.

That's fine.

Been there too.

[Dogempire]

Unless.. (drumroll)

You already have a monk.

I would like to see the comparison between a 4 monk comp and a proper comp, though.

I mean if you have a monk then you can switch to black mage or dragoon or really any of the upper half dps jobs.