"Please Kick Me..." - Just Take Your Penalty

[Vesuvias]

How about we just implement a system where your entry regardless of clear counts for your roulette that way it forces people to stay for the full run, or get no credit.

[Kuwaitum]

4) And lastly, there are other ways of dealing with people cherry-picking dungeons if that's what you're really trying to stop. For example, have roulettes where they count on entering rather than on completion; if you enter a roulette and leave, you lose the roulette for the day. You can still play, you can still queue, get exp. or whatever. You just lose your bonus. I think that's fair. Sure, you will lose your roulette if you get DC'ed and that stinks but it's no more the end of the world than a 30 min penalty is.

I agree with the bonus loss, mind I'd keep it if duty is abondoned with support of ALL members.

Other than that, I'm with penalty implantation since I have seen it playing well after the stupid "leaving" Cheap-coward-tanks used to do. I think that AFK dismissal should have penalty (the person who really is AFK doesn't really on the game, so 60 minutes will be fair, yes 60 not 30 for AFK) so leave with 30 or be dismissed with 60.
Another thing I loved about last update, that dismissed player will not return to the dismisee party.

Last point, I -myself- leave when the duty is unbearable or I have something in real life to take care of, as I appologize and leave.

Yet, I don't mind dismissing anyone who asks for it, I prefer people who are straight forward. She/he doesn't like this duty and wants an instant re-queue.. Ok, i love your honesty, I don't mind I hope the others won't.

Ironically, when I say that I never had a quitter on my team.

[Synestra]

Uh, you're making a pretty huge assumption here. Most people don't ask to be kicked because of other people in the party.

Friend of mine has been getting insanely horrible groups lately where dps is pulling sub 200dps healers dont heal and tanks spamming one skill etc.. so its not always the dungeon that makes you want to leave, and its not always justified to get penalty when you can clearly see that you group cannot even clear a trash letalone bosses(and when you mention them that they need to stepup lil bit many will pull the "i pay my sub so i can do whatever" card). So in scenarios like these i can totally see why one would ask to be kicked instead leaving and getting penalty.

[PuppytimusLeoroccanz]

*Ques for Duty Roulette leveling as a tank:

Enters into Aurum Vale/Dzemael Darkhold or any dungeon etc

Do I want to full clear?
No > Short run / minimal clear
Yes > Ask party
Party says Yes > Do full clear
Party says No > Do minimal clear

Both dps doesn't let the tank pull aggro and just keeps unloading?
Explain and tell both dps to let the tank generate enmity first
DPS agree > continue dungeon
DPS ignore > try to keep up, give it my 200% if needed and continue

If wiped and DPS still ignore and do their own thing > Vote abandon
Vote abandon pass > Out of dungeon
Vote abandon fail > and if DPS still want to act the same, tell the party {I'm Sorry} {I'm not up for it}
leave the dungeon

At least that is how I'd do it, not everyone is the same. I don't think my method is to be even considered good but that is how I have been doing it and will continue to do so.

[Rhaja]

Honestly, when it comes down between them willingly sitting there stubbornly, or just getting someone else, I'll kick them. Time is getting rather thin for this game, and i'd rather not waste it on someone who will force us into a stand still.

[Evangela]

It's funny how people are trying so hard to find a way to force the others to play the game with them.

they have freedom and human rights too, you know?

"you have to play the game with me or you'll be punished!!" ok, calm down, guys.

[Eidolon]

They stand around AFK waiting for a vote kick because then they circumvent the penalty timer and are able to cherry pick a different group. The best way to prevent this type of behaviour, imo, is to implement a penalty timer on the players who get vote kicked.

Asking/expecting the rest of the party to use their limited vote kick option is selfish.

asking it is not selfish. expecting/demanding it would be.

Asking is just that - a request. Why is it so hard to say "Sorry, I don't want to use my votekick up."? No, instead, 9/10 times when I see someone in my party request a votekick, the responses I see people get:

"sorry, you're going to have to stay the entire time" <- basically implying you're holding someone hostage.
"Go eat a penalty" <- usually complete with some kind of insult.
"I don't want to risk another DPS joining who would be able to lot on my item" <- just as greedy as anyone else.

These two responses are far ruder. However, they're not always unprovoked. They're often responses to the way people ask - if you say "ugh just kick me", "God you guys suck - kick me or I afk" then I don't blame people for refusing to kick you. You're just being a piece of **** at that point.


Ultimately, however, I disagree with the OP. Someone asking to be booted is better than someone voting to dismiss when there are people still in the party who want to keep going at it. Asking to be booted instead of bringing down the party when done correctly is ideal.


And yea, there's more reasons that someone might need a kick. One of their friends might be asking for help (Thus the 30 minute que is counter to that); they might need to go afk for 5-10 minutes and don't want to hold the party back, but will want to que when they get back; they might just not feel up to running whatever it is they got any further (Wiping 3+ times on a single run.) As long as they put in the effort to give you a few tries, why do you care so much if they politely ask to be removed to move on to something else?

Being polite about it is 9/10ths of the fight - and I won't deny, I've requested a boot before. Particularly, on my DRG when I was running WoD after switching mains from WAR to DRG. I needed to get the gear, and the first boss ddrops the item I needed. Running on limited time before raid, so I typed polite requests and got kicked per the request.

Sometimes I think people would rather make themselves suffer.

[Assirra]

Friend of mine has been getting insanely horrible groups lately where dps is pulling sub 200dps healers dont heal and tanks spamming one skill etc.. so its not always the dungeon that makes you want to leave, and its not always justified to get penalty when you can clearly see that you group cannot even clear a trash letalone bosses(and when you mention them that they need to stepup lil bit many will pull the "i pay my sub so i can do whatever" card). So in scenarios like these i can totally see why one would ask to be kicked instead leaving and getting penalty.

If i get such groups i take a penalty with a smile on my face rather then keep going.
It does not matter why you want one, you are actively breaking the game rules by asking a kick.

[RiceisNice]

maybe said individual and yourself or another member of the party arent getting along.

This is hardly ever the chase if they're asking to be kick within the first five minutes of the dungeon they didn't want... I'm starting to see some people are speaking out of context when going against penalties for vote kicking or telling them to deal with it.

And unfortunately, this often becomes worse if the person that wants to be kicked is a tank or healer anyway because now you're looking for people who want to queue for inprogress. The party gets all of the burden while the person who wants to be kicked simply because they don't want to do the dungeon (that was handed to them in a roulette no less) and they want to cherry pick it.

asking....

Passive agressiveness, you can still be selfish without sounding it like.

If someone wants get kicked out of a dungeon because they don't like it (especially when it's a roulette), they just want to circumvent the leaving penalty and requeue immediately. What's the damn point of having a DF penalty in the first place if they can do this? It's in place for a reason, and players should commit to finishing the dungeon. If something comes up that they have to leave, then I'm sure a 30 minute penalty won't hurt them anyway (and chances are the party is flunked if you were the tank or healer for that)

And yea, there's more reasons that someone might need a kick. One of their friends might be asking for help (Thus the 30 minute que is counter to that); they might need to go afk for 5-10 minutes and don't want to hold the party back, but will want to que when they get back; they might just not feel up to running whatever it is they got any further (Wiping 3+ times on a single run.) As long as they put in the effort to give you a few tries, why do you care so much if they politely ask to be removed to move on to something else?

Again, you're still asking out of your own self benefit. You want to requeue again after exiting a dungeon that was in progress. Is your friend not understanding to wait an extra 10-15 minutes for you to finish what you're doing or to place the burden on your party (especially if you were the tank or healer in that) And what happens if everyone in the party has their vote kick on cooldown because of joe shmuck they had to dismiss a couple of hours back (and ended up abandoning because they couldn't get a tank,) what are you going to do then?

Being polite about it is 9/10ths of the fight - and I won't deny, I've requested a boot before. Particularly, on my DRG when I was running WoD after switching mains from WAR to DRG. I needed to get the gear, and the first boss ddrops the item I needed. Running on limited time before raid, so I typed polite requests and got kicked per the request.

The matter of question is why you're doing WoD so close to your raid time, or why not push raid time a little bit if everyone knew that this was the case (you needed to gear up your warrior for raid)? This is still the equivalent of loot and scooping, except now you're asking someone to use up their 4-hour allowance (and depending on if they're doing more roulettes, they might've legitmately needed it down the road). And if this was before FCoB was put on duty finder then welp....

[Waeksyn]

Had a similar experience in Alex floor1 vs oppressor. Party wiped at 4% hp due to rage timer, understandable since 2 dps were new and just getting used to the fight. One healer says dps sucks and we can't clear then AFKS by the door for 10min before the entire pt broke from this healer wanting to be vote kicked.

Its obvious we could have cleared it with 1 more pull but this person trying to abuse the system broke the entire run AND still got his way when people started leaving. The one time I decide not to come healer...could have solo healed it, figures...

And so to prove a point, you let the person sit rather than vote kick him. The result? The party had to disband anyway after wasting 10 more minutes in which time a replacement would likely have joined and you would have finished the dungeon.

I understand the frustration around vote kick. What I don't understand is how people are ready to screw themselves over to prove a point. Just kick them and get on with it.