#FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE

[Kinazu]

I'll leave other people to answer the rest, but I want to address this one because I did level my SCH to 100 to give the content a fair chance because I don't like talking about something I haven't dabbled in.

No, the additions are not good. We still spend a lot of our time mashing a single button. A new button that we press every 2 minutes is not enough to break the monotony of mashing 1 filler GCD for anywhere from 60-90% of a fight.

I cannot say that the kit changes are a step in the right direction. In fact, the change to make SGE's DoTs mutually exclusive from each other is a step in the WRONG direction.

I can say, however, that the fight design is a step in the right direction. There's no body checks so far, so recovery healing does have importance once again. The healing requirements could be upped more though as even though people were raving about how hard DT content is to heal, I still managed to basically soloheal EX1 on my first clear as a healer.

Thank you for the response! Whereas I don't mind the button mashing too much myself even though I have been doing it for years, I do understand why some may want a change of pace. Though it does help me to solely focus on mechanics when I'm still learning and optimizing, I will agree that it is pretty repetitive once you've got something down on farm level and no one makes any mistakes.

I also agree on the Sage DoT, why they didn't make them stack is still baffling to me, I was disappointed when I found out they could not stack.

As for the fights - I personally think they're for sure in the right direction. I also like the swap from vulnerability stack to DoT instead.

Having done both EX 1 and EX 2 on White Mage, I did feel like I had to heal a bit more than usual, but that can probably be chalked up to people not being geared and not knowing the fights too well. It is unfortunate to hear that you're not enjoying healing anymore though.

^you are allowed to like healers that’s fine. As for your questions

1) it’s not disruptive because we are interacting with the game as anyone is allowed to. We don’t enjoy the role so we don’t play it, it’s the same as anyone who is like “I’m not a fan of melee”

2) DF no change but I don’t expect one, PF is crying out for healers right now which seems to indicate healers aren’t popular

3)I have only SCH levelled which I did with the MSQ, I don’t intend to level the others in DF, if square decides to take data I levelled classes with trusts as indication inter job design is good that’s their prerogative (even if I think it’s stupid)

4) I basically want HW healers, I want to heal more on the GCD but in the downtime I want more engaging DPS

5) NA haven’t played DT healers outside a static for EX 1 where I think they are still garbage

Thank you for the insights!

1) That's absolutely fair and reasonable.

2) Admittedly, I haven't been in PF much but from what I have seen it's been a mixed bag. Data Centre difference, probably! I have notice a very small increase of Healer in Need when it comes to roulettes but that's really about it. The waiting times are roughly the same as it always has been.

3) It is what it is I suppose.

4) I enjoyed the HW Healers too, but part of me also remembers it not being that differently either. Scholar could just solo dungeons with Eos without having to heal anyone and I don't remember having to GCD heal that much more in HW either, slightly more, yes, but not that much.

I do agree on the DPS-side of things when it comes to HW though. I for one did enjoy Cleric Stance and the punishment that came with it for activating it at a wrong time and juggling a few dots was fun too!

5) I'm sorry to hear that you're not getting the fulfilment that you seek out of the role. Let's hope that SE can make more people happy in the future, even though it's some time away.

1) It's intended as a message to the devs, the effects on other players are not the goal. And the strike isn't intended to support things like "queue up as a healer, but don't heal". Or harrash people who play healers. Or what ever other disruptive behaviour you can think of.

2) I am seeing far more healer in need then before.

3) It's not realistic to expect people ignore story content (role quests). So wisely the person that initiated the strike didn't ask people to do that. If you feel like that should be done, you are free to create your own initiative.

4) In short.
- Some more variation in damage buttons during lulls. Nothing extreme, but also not just 1 extra button to use during buff windows.
- More unavoidable damage on bossfights. DT increased difficulty for avoidable damage. But hoping for lower skilled, or lower geared, players to have some "healing fun" still isn't good enough.
- Rebalancing for healing output between jobs/roles. The most egregious example: for solo or small group healing, a WHM and WAR have about the same ogcd healing potential. And that is not even counting the per target heal from bloodwhetting.

Thank you for the reply!

1) I see, fair enough.

2) Whereas I see a bit more than before, it's not that different from what it used to be, but, AiN is a moment's notice and can shift whenever.

3) Not trying to form a narrative, just throwing out my thoughts. If SE wanted to spin a narrative, they could probably. Again, I'm neither against or with you, just neutral in the whole thing. Was just curious if anyone had given it any thoughts when it comes down to showing proof with data. That's all.

4) So a mixed bag of changes, a bit of everything. That's fair and probably what is needed in the long run, I agree.

[Ramiee]

WHM in general is close to being fun. If they just made glare 4 a proc and added a psych like move with a cast time I think WHM would be a pretty fun job. Also it's slide should be 20-30 seconds no reason it needs to be 60 when PCT has a 20 second slide with an added sprint.

[Laerune]

I am not a fan of having one of my attacks locked behind a debuff.

If the developers are afraid that healers will be overwhelmed with more dps skills, why not use the viper/picto action button? This way healers can have single target and aoe dps rotation.

[Reinha]

Before getting any flack from the usual people though, I'll preface this by saying that although I don't support the strike myself as I still enjoy Healers in general (I think I'm allowed to have that opinion, no?), I do agree that some changes could improve the role. So again, this is not an attack just genuine curiosity and me wanting some insights about the strike.

1) From what I'm gathering those who support the strike are not queuing up for DF and PF content, yet in the OP it is mentioned that the strike is not meant to be disruptive for those playing the game. Isn't this counter productive in a way?

You are allowed to enjoy healing. Strikers are queuing to DF and PF as other roles. Choosing a fun role is what everyone is entitled to as a paying customer. It is not disruptive, because the purpose is not to harass people who enjoy healing (such as yourself) or to intentionally troll parties.

2) As a follow up, do those that support the strike feel like an impact has been made regarding the no using of PF/DF-route?

Personally, I don't haven't felt difference, but again maybe some of you do. I'd like to hear some insights on this one.

The impact has been to garner support from others who feel the same, bring the discussion regarding healers to the top where the devs will see it instead of burying it in the healer forum for another 5 years, and also to gain more personal enjoyment by playing jobs that are actually fun. Media coverage was a nice bonus. If you meant queue times, you probably haven't felt the difference since you are a healer and as we know instant queues can't get anymore instant. My queues are certainly longer than they were in Endwalker.

3) Another show for the strike would be to not level Healers, however some have. Isn't this also counter productive due to the achievements tied to obtaining Lv. 100? If anything anyone who levels either White, Astrologian, Sage, Scholar & Summoner regardless of how it's achieved, could, in essence be counted to Healers. Correct me if I'm wrong on this though, but data-wise it could. And SE could use this as a tell sign of how many Healers there are compared to different expansion.

A counterpoint would be the fact they are now changing Viper, which is the most played job of all. If the devs are comfortable changing the most played job before any feedback has even had time to accumulate, then clearly it does not matter what jobs people play and jobs can be modified regardless of that.

4) What are the changes people actually do want? As I see mixed changes. Some want more DPS options, others want more healing, another wants DPS rotations, that one in the corner wants tank sustain to be tuned back. Or is it a mix of everything?

I'm still rather confused what the strike is supposed to manage/change and there are too many posts in the thread now to backtrack and the OP has not been updated to reflect examples of core changes with clear examples.

A mix of everything that makes the gameplay loop not be "glare glare glare glare glare glare glare glare glare". It might make you less confused if you look at the bullet points for the core changes being requested in the OP and the older feedback thread linked in the OP.

[Kinazu]

You are allowed to enjoy healing. Strikers are queuing to DF and PF as other roles. Choosing a fun role is what everyone is entitled to as a paying customer. It is not disruptive, because the purpose is not to harass people who enjoy healing (such as yourself) or to intentionally troll parties.



The impact has been to garner support from others who feel the same, bring the discussion regarding healers to the top where the devs will see it instead of burying it in the healer forum for another 5 years, and also to gain more personal enjoyment by playing jobs that are actually fun. Media coverage was a nice bonus. If you meant queue times, you probably haven't felt the difference since you are a healer and as we know instant queues can't get anymore instant. My queues are certainly longer than they were in Endwalker.



A counterpoint would be the fact they are now changing Viper, which is the most played job of all. If the devs are comfortable changing the most played job before any feedback has even had time to accumulate, then clearly it does not matter what jobs people play and jobs can be modified regardless of that.



A mix of everything that makes the gameplay loop not be "glare glare glare glare glare glare glare glare glare". It might make you less confused if you look at the bullet points for the core changes being requested in the OP and the older feedback thread linked in the OP.

Thank you for the reply!

To start off, I think I kinda understand it now. By not playing Healers in DF/PF but still playing the game as a different role (therefore making sure that there are less Healers in rotation) the initiative is to show SE that there are less Healers in DF/PF. Fair enough.

There might be a little misconception about the 2nd point: I'm not a Healer main in essence. Yes, I enjoy it and yes I have done Savage and Ultimate as a Healer, however the sole reason was that my groups were not able to get a Healer so I offered to do so instead. I have considered myself a Caster main for a long while and I really enjoy Pictomancer, and I am really looking forward to finally jump into the new raids as a Caster. But even then, levelling my DPS's I haven't really felt an increase in queue times. But again, that's my personal experience and it will be different for everyone. Just because I experience it one way, doesn't mean someone else will see it the same way!

When it comes to the Viper change I think this is a wait-and-see scenario. I don't think we've got an update on what the change will be to make it "less busy". My only thoughts regarding it is by removing the two oGCDs after certain attacks and make it only a single oGCD, other than that I honestly do not expect a full-on rework of the job, just a minor change. But we'll see!

And, yeah. I can understand that a lot of people may get sick of pressing the same key hundreds of times in a fight back-to-back. Would a "rotation" like Pictomancer be acceptable? So, still 1-1-1, but it looks like a 1-2-3, or do you think they really should focus on a 1-2-3 kind of rotation? Or maybe a 1-2 with 2 having a chance to proc 3?

I'm curious to hear what you (and others) would find a good solution to the DPS side of the Healer problem.

[Reinha]

And, yeah. I can understand that a lot of people may get sick of pressing the same key hundreds of times in a fight back-to-back. Would a "rotation" like Pictomancer be acceptable? So, still 1-1-1, but it looks like a 1-2-3, or do you think they really should focus on a 1-2-3 kind of rotation? Or maybe a 1-2 with 2 having a chance to proc 3?

I'm curious to hear what you (and others) would find a good solution to the DPS side of the Healer problem.

Anything. Any change at all that solves the problem.

There have been disingenuous people in this thread claiming healers "contradict each other" and "can't come to an agreement" about the solution to repetitive rotations because people have thrown around ideas regarding how it could be solved. I want to make it abundantly clear that I'm OK with any solution.

[ServantNaoya]

Thank you for the reply!

To start off, I think I kinda understand it now. By not playing Healers in DF/PF but still playing the game as a different role (therefore making sure that there are less Healers in rotation) the initiative is to show SE that there are less Healers in DF/PF. Fair enough.

There might be a little misconception about the 2nd point: I'm not a Healer main in essence. Yes, I enjoy it and yes I have done Savage and Ultimate as a Healer, however the sole reason was that my groups were not able to get a Healer so I offered to do so instead. I have considered myself a Caster main for a long while and I really enjoy Pictomancer, and I am really looking forward to finally jump into the new raids as a Caster. But even then, levelling my DPS's I haven't really felt an increase in queue times. But again, that's my personal experience and it will be different for everyone. Just because I experience it one way, doesn't mean someone else will see it the same way!

When it comes to the Viper change I think this is a wait-and-see scenario. I don't think we've got an update on what the change will be to make it "less busy". My only thoughts regarding it is by removing the two oGCDs after certain attacks and make it only a single oGCD, other than that I honestly do not expect a full-on rework of the job, just a minor change. But we'll see!

And, yeah. I can understand that a lot of people may get sick of pressing the same key hundreds of times in a fight back-to-back. Would a "rotation" like Pictomancer be acceptable? So, still 1-1-1, but it looks like a 1-2-3, or do you think they really should focus on a 1-2-3 kind of rotation? Or maybe a 1-2 with 2 having a chance to proc 3?

I'm curious to hear what you (and others) would find a good solution to the DPS side of the Healer problem.

As someone who's never seriously played healer since SB, I just want stuff to keep track of. I don't think we'll ever get back to the days of HW Scholar, as much as I miss it, but juggling two or three dots, maybe a proc spell, would be all I'd ask. More active buttons, rather than the passive ones we got in this expansion, even if they were a step in the right direction. For instance, if we could stack the two DoTs Sage has, and they had different timers on them, I'd be pretty happy already. It'd be a good starting point for me.

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

[...]I'm curious to hear what you (and others) would find a good solution to the DPS side of the Healer problem.

There has been mountainous of suggestions being piled into the healer subforum (I had a good amount myself), but it's been reiterated ad nauseum at this point I personally don't feel like doing that once more, at least for now. (Sorry!)

But for the record IMHO, even 1 button spam can be a tad more interesting when more is given than what we have right now. One of the main issue to me with their 1 button spam design is they build up to nothing at all but your Glaroilficosis counter. A low bar example that I could think about "1 button spam builds that builds into something" was the ShB PvP SCH. Every Broil accumulates fae gauge pts. Those fae gauge pts can later be spent to use Dissipation which increase both your damage and healing capability for limited amount of time (you have to choose though, somewhat). Again, low bar to clear, and there are many more better suggestions. But it's still far more than today's 1 button spam just for the sake of...1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1.

[Kinazu]

I'm just gonna butt in one more time to give a general thank you to the people responding. The insight was helpful and I think I grasp the whole situation a lot better now. Despite a lot of things already been said, as some of you pointed out, it was buried underneath hundreds of posts and different threads so I appreciate all the hands-on insights!

I do hope you all get what you wish for in the future updates/expansions, so we all can enjoy Healers (again).

[Post]

Who has been doing the new dungeons 1 tank and 3 DPS on a regular basis and how has that been going for you?

That was supposed to be another way to show SE how the healer role is poorly designed.

I've been doing it every chance I've gotten. Not really for proof of anything, just because it's been more fun.

It was only a challenge to fill parties because people just going through MSQ or doing new dungeons... Don't check PF. People tend to try to avoid spoilers and use the convenient DF system, let alone a growing number of players that avail themselves of Duty Support even for trials. Usually only manage to go when I've got a group of 3 friends and we've only ever wiped when blind to an encounter like this. Technically never wiped on trash. Technically.

I wouldn't say that the duties this expansion themselves were easier blind than normal, but the amount of unavoidable damage has been mostly comparable, so still if everyone dodges it's fine, and you have plenty of room for recovery with a WAR or PLD, let alone a RDM or SMN rezzer.

I recommend giving it a go if you're tired of how healers play, we've even done 2tank 2dps (when someone didn't have DPS leveled) and that was still faster and more fun to heal as!