Red mage 7.0 Wishlist

[Rychu]

No I'm really not,

If you are really doing it that way, you are spending way too much time building up to 100 Mana when you don't need to anymore. In reality you only need to build up to 50 mana to do a combo, I go 60 for a buffer but not always. The Dual Casts are about half what you demonstrated in your chart. It's why I'm sitting in melee all the time. You get even a single proc which you usually do after a finisher, and you're building much faster even than that. The only time I'm up at 100 Mana is when I'm building up for Boss fight with trashmobs in dungeon or Alliance Raid for the next fight.

*homie gets shown definitive calculations of time to prove how long it takes to build up the same mobility as summoner* "nuh uhhhhh*

Secondly you are assuming everything is an 8-Man what you showed only applies there, not to Alliance Raids or Expert Dungeons.

That's because the game is balanced around the 8-man content, the rest of the game's battle content like alliance raids, deep dungeons, and casual MSQ progression all balance themselves around the players that do savage and ultimate because it's easier to do it that way.

But even if you were to assume that, You're still spending time building to 100 when you no longer have to do that. It's much quicker these days. Yeah Enchanted Reprise kinda falls into the unused toolset now, but doing faster finishers will do more damage in the end, because that's the big damage portion and you do it much faster and more of them.

That is and I mean this quite literally, not how it works. It still takes almost the same amount of time to build up your mana between the old 80/80 and the current 50/50 "Developer confirmed", you are just able to build up more of it. And process this for me, saving 50/50 mana and doing your combo does not provide more damage "by doing faster finishers will do more damage in the end" than saving almost 100 and doing them both back to back...because you'll still have to save up another 50/50 mana to so a second combo.

And it is because of that, and because you end up just sitting in melee range all the time that I am starting to suggest staying power in melee. Hence the Adlo idea and DEFINITELY extending the Magic Barrier to be the equivalent time to Embolden.

I agree. Completely actually, for magick barrier at least. It is incredibly stupid that a spell we get at such a high level provides so little overall. It is super ironic that the same expansion that Red Mage gets a magic only utility spell, is also the same expansion that has the harder physical damage healer check we have ever seen. I am personally more of the opinion that it should mitigate all damage by 10% and increase the duration to 15 seconds. The 5% healing boost is also so small it might as well not be there.

[Silverquick]

*homie gets shown definitive calculations of time to prove how long it takes to build up the same mobility as summoner* "nuh uhhhhh*

No the calculations are incorrect and misleading.

I pointed out they only apply to one kind of content, second of all they don't apply to reality in that content. I didn't go into it, because I had already pointed out the problems with it.

But... first of all... spending that much time going to 100% Mana Gauge or thereabouts means you are going to be wasting time sitting there for no reason stationary.

Nor does it jive with the very things Rongway was advocating back in the day. I knew he was pushing something inaccurate from the beginning and something even he didn't believe in. He and other RDMS were the ones saying you don't need to go to 100% anymore just blow as many combos as you can as soon as you reach that 50% or therabouts mark. (Which by the way is something I implemented in my playstyle, because... it worked, even if back then it didn't net much... it does today.)

Secondly it does not apply the Verfire/verstone ready that the Finisher often invokes making the Mana Gain much faster than demonstrated in that chart... ergo those numbers are not accurate.

Thirdly it doesn't take into account any procs after that, which further reduce the dual casting which again make that not very accurate.

Reality is?

Likely you're only going to be doing 4-6 dual casts before blowing a 2000+ potency combo. Which is a far cry from 12.

[Rongway]

No the calculations are incorrect and misleading.

I pointed out they only apply to one kind of content, second of all they don't apply to reality in that content. I didn't go into it, because I had already pointed out the problems with it.

But... first of all... spending that much time going to 100% Mana Gauge or thereabouts means you are going to be wasting time sitting there for no reason stationary.

Nor does it jive with the very things Rongway was advocating back in the day. I knew he was pushing something inaccurate from the beginning and something even he didn't believe in. He and other RDMS were the ones saying you don't need to go to 100% anymore just blow as many combos as you can as soon as you reach that 50% or therabouts mark. (Which by the way is something I implemented in my playstyle, because... it worked, even if back then it didn't net much... it does today.)

Secondly it does not apply the Verfire/verstone ready that the Finisher often invokes making the Mana Gain much faster than demonstrated in that chart... ergo those numbers are not accurate.

Thirdly it doesn't take into account any procs after that, which further reduce the dual casting which again make that not very accurate.

Reality is?

Likely you're only going to be doing 4-6 dual casts before blowing a 2000+ potency combo. Which is a far cry from 12.

All those things you're talking about are things my calculations accounted for. Insofar as total movement vs total casting is concerned, there is no difference between building up to a triple combo or using combos immediately as they become available. You still have to spend the same total time casting, and that table I wrote up includes the 8|19 or 19|8 Mana rebates from Verfinishing and lays out the best case scenario assuming 100% procs. If you're only thinking about one combo at a time you need to triple the number of casts you think you're doing because my calculations are for a 110-ish second rotation that includes three combos.



About deciding whether to bank combos or use them immediately: EW RDM adjustments gave us, in many but not all cases, the flexibility to use one combo per minute specifically as a movement tool while still having one combo available for the party burst. There's also the option to reserve one of those movement combos so that there are two combos available during the party burst (though Embolden and other 20s buffs only give you time for 1.5 combos). Most of the time there is no additional benefit to performing a triple combo because 1.5 of those combos are going to be outside of the party burst no matter what and it's really easy to overcap while doing so. The exception to this is during the potion burst window, which will cover about 2.5 combos. Regardless of which of these options you choose, the total time spent casting will be the same. None of these choices offers more total mobility than the others; the only difference is when that mobility is available.

[Rongway]

Hey, so, I super get how frustrating it can be when other people don't understand things the first time, and I sometimes slip myself and let out an exasperated "clearly you don't understand..." when I'm replying hangry, but maybe let's not flat out call people stupid while we're trying to get them to understand.

[Rychu]

I did not mean to offend, and Rongway was kind of right, I needed to sleep for a few hours. I apologize for being rude. I still stand by my assertions. There are plenty of reasons to hold off from doing your sword combo immediately, they come up very frequently during savage and ultimate encounters that you use the sword combo not for the big 2000+ potency of damage but purely for mobility and wasting it for damage will harm the progress of your entire group. If you disagree then it is what it is, but you have to at least come to terms with the calculations done by Rongway and myself.