Alliance Raids and players not waiting for Cutscene Watchers

[Raoabolic]

Now something I’ll repeat from earlier in this thread but I’ll word it slightly different. I’ll wait if you ask nicely. Don’t demand of me. It’s rude and I’ll show you and your cutscene the same respect you gave me.

That's actually a pretty good stance on that. All you have to do is ask nicely and more tha- *Mentor Crown runs in and engages boss*
HOLD THAT THOUGHT, GOTTA KILL RQ!

[LittleImp]

But this community likes to get offended for others.

It always does feel like the people who have meltdowns in shout over early-pulling were just like.. waiting, hoping they're given a reason to start a conflict. It's like those tanks in dungeons who try to bait people into pulling mobs on accident so that they can have a righteous meltdown. I know a few people like this personally through FCs and stuff, and they really are just constantly hoping for outrage so they can posture and make gestures to assert their "good person" status. Most of them, unsurprisingly, aren't actually good people when you dig beneath the surface.

[Kolaina]

Snip.

Exactly. There’s usually one person just waiting to snap. Let all their hatred out. But need to justify it with “but they (the early puller) are the bad guy”. Worse yet is when other people jump in. As if the gates have been open and the light turned green. There are some downright angry and horrible people in this game just looking for any excuse to get a pass for such behaviour

[IttyBitty]

Other raids do exist and you only get to experience something for the first time once.

I can assure you sprouts will continue to live just fine, regardless if they missed Xande punching a tank in the face, 9S shooting a tank in the face and shooting some lasers, or Yiazmat tearing a tank's face off and dropping some puddles, all of which they will see multiple times throughout the fight, in content that was designed to be ran at least once weekly, because the cutscenes are generally only around a minute long at most.

To see people compare alliance raids to MSQ, which has cutscenes that are so long that it's possible to completely skip some if people do the fights without you, is patently ridiculous.

[Cheremia]

Exactly. There’s usually one person just waiting to snap. Let all their hatred out. But need to justify it with “but they (the early puller) are the bad guy”. Worse yet is when other people jump in. As if the gates have been open and the light turned green. There are some downright angry and horrible people in this game just looking for any excuse to get a pass for such behaviour

Yes weird coming from me who is all blabla wait blabla, i know.

But agreed, no need to be all hostile about it either.
Thats literally not helping at all.

There are people that do early pull despite being asked by the person themself and also, i think "i'm new" is supposed to signal that they dont know anything and means cutscene, but thats how I see it.
It's just... it DOES go both ways, always will, always has.

But being "hostile" on purpose (like some replies to me) will not help at all. Pretty sure they want to tickle something out of me that isn't even there.

In fact, i'm not even trying to be offended for others, i speak in general but I am in no way holier than thou.

My mind is just "waiting if new people are there is nice since you were (and will be) new sometime and its not their fault for starting later than you"

I can assure you sprouts will continue to live just fine, regardless if they missed Xande punching a tank in the face, 9S shooting a tank in the face and shooting some lasers, or Yiazmat tearing a tank's face off and dropping some puddles, all of which they will see multiple times throughout the fight, in content that was designed to be ran at least once weekly.

And maybe get lasered, stoned (big doggo), getting some vuln up, getting hit by avoidable things because they just zoned in but that's neither here or there i guess.

Boss cutscenes have story to it, especially Ivalice especially for those who played Ivalice.
And Nier raids also give context to why the bass looks how it looks and is part of the story.
That's... the point. They have a story. It's not at all like msq THANK GOD but its a bit of context for the overall thing.
Watch them again for a refresher maybe? They have context to them...

[Beytran70]

Now something I’ll repeat from earlier in this thread but I’ll word it slightly different. I’ll wait if you ask nicely. Don’t demand of me. It’s rude and I’ll show you and your cutscene the same respect you gave me. Don’t demand for others. The person in cutscene may not care one way or the other. But this community likes to get offended for others. If no one says anything, or makes a demand of me, I’ll pull without thinking about it. More so when demanded. You get what you give

I don't entirely disagree with this stance, but to play devil's advocate and defend the sprouts, how many true sprouts do you generally see say ANYTHING in the chat? Most regular players barely say anything, so if a sprout was brand new to an instance and is being taken in by all the cool cutscenes and stuff, do you really think they would pipe up (bringing their UI in and distracting them from said scene) to say, "yo wait up." I don't think so, and I've definitely never seen it, so while it may sound like a logical thing to do, it might not be practical.

[MaxCarnage]

The real problem with that idea is that other players just bully the person watching cutscenes into skipping so they can continue.

I mean, in my two years of playing, I have never seen anyone bully someone into skipping a cutscene. The only bullying I have EVER seen in regards to someone pulling during cutscene is people bullying and attacking the person who did it.

*Benny Hill Music*

Unfortunately, expecting players to behave like humans online is unrealistic.

some answers here made me realize that it's just because people are jerks.[...]if you can't wait a few minutes you have some serious patience problems. [...]If you can't even wait that long,y ou shouldn't queue for alliance raids (which can take up to 1h) to begin with.

I never had a problem waiting, good time to check for messages and stuff too. I also don't have a tickling timebomb attached to me that explodes if I pause a minute, but that mgith be just me.

Because they expect you to have manners and wait when you see a new player.

there is also something out there called Common Courtesy but guess that is to much to ask for.
Don't get why everything has to fast fast fast its like people has a gun to their heads or something,

More and more WoW refugees and players from other MMOs where speed was the name of the game and they didn't wait for anyone, ever. Or salty veteran players with a hidden grudge against newcomers or that don't remember their own days as sprouts.

People in here act like it is the end of the world. [People with OCD need full experience]. Because of your impatience, now they have to run a 30-45 minute raid again because you are too selfish to take your 2 minute bio break in your jar during the CS.

i have seen toxic cases often enough in which people were complaining about cutscene watchers (of which a few definitely were new) [and early pulled]. Im glad that they failed hard and ragequited at some point.

Personally, if you really cant abide being in there that much, then dont que for the content.

This thread has made me wish they forced players to watch cutscenes like with Prae just so people's first-time experiences aren't ruined because of it. Clearly people just lack the courtesy to let other players enjoy their first time and something needs to be done about it.

Then, as I'm pretty sure you told someone else in another thread, maybe this game isn't for you. Go play a solo game.

You're right. You were quoting someone that said it, but my message to you remains.

People like yourself are the reason I wish I wouldn't have came back to the game.

If you're pulling as anyone but the tank I'm going to let you die if I'm your tank or healer regardless if someone is watching a cutscene or not.

Giving your fellow first-time players a courtesy of only probably what, 2 or 3 minutes? of waiting while they watch cutscene is just something that is so easy and painless to do, I just don't understand the selfishness of not even wanting to do that. It's mind-boggling. Is it really that hard/difficult to do?

I assure you were we in a 4 man, which is the scenario you mentioned, and I am the tank, and you pull as a dps, nobody is going to defend you, nobody is going to be mad at me for letting you die. I'm also sure nobody would oppose if I initiated a vote-kick which odds are I would. To suggest you, knowingly, doing something toxic, being responded to predictably, then painting the people you were toxic towards as the bad guys and suggesting they be banned (and I have seen you in other threads on this topic suggest cutscene watchers are breaking TOS for watching cutscenes after you pulled without warning or consent (and not even as the tank) because they were too busy watching a cutscene to help). This is the literal definition of being passive aggressive, I'd go further and argue this is just straight up anti-social behavior.

In an alliance raid? Sure you'll probably get away with it. You might not, though. But in dungeon? No, I assure you you will be running in alone and recieving no heals or taunting off, and odds are end up vote-kicked. It doesn't matter if you don't cause a wipe, you're displaying an extremely toxic attitude and utter lack of respect for other players which I have zero tolerance or patience for.

Do you have absolutely zero self-awareness, and lack even the most basic level of empathy and perspective. [...]If many of the takes in this thread are an indication of the current state of the community than by god SE has somehow managed to breed one of the most anti-social communities in the entire MMO-market.

THAT is why Prae is now unskippable, because players were abusing others for wanting to see the cutscenes, puling early. Prae is unskippable owing to the mentality "they can watch it later"

Dude you should give up talking to her.. she a awful person with a bad attitude when it comes to new players and she won't change.. she's also one of those people who happily admits to ilvl cheesing people into only getting crystal tower. She's only after rewards and items for herself an screw anyone else.

Why is not being an a-hole a debatable topic? Wait for the newbies. And if you don't want to make your own party with your own parameters. It's not rocket surgery. Heck it's not even brain science.

Its sad we even have to have a discussion about just being a decent human being to others.

[Kolaina]

Snip

“Im new” to me only means “sorry if I screw up, die or don’t dps enough” not “I’d like to watch the cutscene AND experience the first mechanic or 2 that will repeat throughout the encounter”. But we interpret things in different ways.

I get the whole “it’s polite to wait” argument. But like anything else, there’s another perspective. Mine being, they are 1 person taking the time of potentially 23 others. Truly neither are wrong. You just happen to disagree with the perspective opposed to yours.

Honestly I’ve never watched a cutscene. Not 1. So yeah, I don’t have any appreciation for the story. But people play for different reasons. Sometimes those reasons clash.

What people need to understand, imo, no one player is more important than any other player. That includes the new player. I know it’s selfish, but as I said already, I play this game for myself. I’m the only player that matters in this game to me. I’ll meet people halfway though. I’ve never, not once, pulled when someone asked politely. I give respect when others give it. I’ll pass on loot if otherwise just turn in for seals if someone asks politely. Not just a “I need the gloves”.

What I will never give in to. Never bow to. Hostility. I will not ever be convinced my early pulling is wrong when berated with threats and insults. No where in any of that dialogue I am receiving will I be convinced theirs is the good argument

[Raoabolic]

*Yoshida sees thread*
*6.1 drops*
*This scene cannot be skipped applied to raids*
*que theme*
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ag1o3koTLWM

[Beytran70]

*Benny Hill Music*

That's a lot of quotes.