We need more ways to make gold in this game.

[Aixa]

I am perfectly aware you guys are refering to gil deflation when the incoming gil is lower than the outgoing gil into game systems. Ive tried to make that clear on my posts.

What im saying is I disagree theres a harsh and heavely marked deflation problem as you guys seem to insist on. And if theres not even if you personally dont create enough gil to cover the npc expenses as long as OTHER people do generate more gil than they take to cover their npc expenses the economy balances out as long as you interact with eachother.

The burden of generating gil isnt on you alone, theres a lot of other players doing it and many are gaining more than they lose so you dont have to.

[TommySmiles]

I see your point but I disagree slightly. The reason it's modeled this way is because people don't get a feeling of accomplishment from "relaxing." Dungeons and battles are supposed to be exciting and fun as well as rewarding; without the reward aspect there's no point to doing any of this.



I disagree with this statement entirely. Can you please tell me why there is a problem to be required to do other things in-game to cover your dungeon running expenses?

Because I have a real job and I don't have 60 hours a week to sink into this game. I want to spend the time I have to play doing what I want. Why can't you sustain yourself doing dungeons? I'm not going to grind up a craft or gathering job to 50 just so that I can go through a dungeon.

Bottom line: I shouldn't be forced into doing crafts/gathering.

[Promethevs]

another way to make gil - find a finished item to craft off of gatherable mats (ideally one that sells for a good chunk & uses few base materials), gather & vendor if need be.
just an example - I vendored probably 100 bas-relief cobalt saws leveling BSM, 10k gil total.

whether things like this are a sufficient supplement to leves/fates, or whether leves/fates are a sufficient standalone on their own, stands to be seen.

[Aixa]

Because I have a real job and I don't have 60 hours a week to sink into this game. I want to spend the time I have to play doing what I want. Why can't you sustain yourself doing dungeons? I'm not going to grind up a craft or gathering job to 50 just so that I can go through a dungeon.

Bottom line: I shouldn't be forced into doing crafts/gathering.

You dont need to do crafts and gathering, theres a healthy demand for battle classes to kill monsters for their drops but only a few are interacting with people enough to know what is desired and whats not.

[Deatheye]

So besides AzuraSin who Claims there is a way to make more Money but it seems she is the only Person that (claims) knows how, there are a few People that don't seem to understand the Problem.

1. The lower you are the lower are your repair costs. At 50 it goes up to 5k easy. The higher the Item lvl is the higher seems the cost to repair it. Since I'm far away from having the highest possible item lvl equiped that cost propably goes up even more. So any low lvl has much lower cost for repairs.
2. Your first class makes a lot of Money with the mainstory. After you've done that the biggest income you had is not available anymore.
3. Crafting doesn't solve this. As soon as no buyer has the Money to afford your crafted stuff anymore you also don't get any Money.

Recently I went into a dungeon all my gear was broken at the end of it... Did cost me a few k allready being not even 40... I didn't get anything near that amount of gil back in that dungeon.
It seems I can't make Money much longer with crafting. Most stuff sells for a tenth what the materials costs.
Gathering also doesn't bring in much Money, my gear Brakes doing this, again needing repairs, prieces on stuff I can gather drop drastically.

I think one part of the Problem is that everyone is using ports to go arround right now. I don't think that was the devs Intention. It Looks more like there are thought for rare use.

Still, using the airship isn't much cheaper. Reapir cost for Equipment doesn't Change. It still Looks like I would loose more gil then I could make.
I'm allready repairing most of my stuff myself. But the items needed to repair also don't cost much less then NPC repairs.

You dont need to do crafts and gathering, theres a healthy demand for battle classes to kill monsters for their drops but only a few are interacting with people enough to know what is desired and whats not.

That's again missing the Point. Where do the crafter get the Money to buy your farmed stuff? Without them buying it you cant repair your eqip and can't farm anything...
Everytime your selling something the buyer looses Money to the market, it gets removed from the game, everytime the crafter sells the product he is making, gil gets removed from the game, it also damages his Equipment, he Needs to make repairs and losses Money..

another way to make gil - find a finished item to craft off of gatherable mats (ideally one that sells for a good chunk & uses few base materials), gather & vendor if need be.
just an example - I vendored probably 100 bas-relief cobalt saws leveling BSM, 10k gil total.

whether things like this are a sufficient supplement to leves/fates, or whether leves/fates are a sufficient standalone on their own, stands to be seen.

Same, missing the Point that way Money only gets moved from one Player to another, a part of it gets lost due to the fees, where does that Money come from the Player spents for your product?

Because I have a real job and I don't have 60 hours a week to sink into this game. I want to spend the time I have to play doing what I want. Why can't you sustain yourself doing dungeons? I'm not going to grind up a craft or gathering job to 50 just so that I can go through a dungeon.

Bottom line: I shouldn't be forced into doing crafts/gathering.

Bottom line also is missing the Point of this Topic. You don't put any Money into the economy, you remove it that way.

At some Point noone will be able to buy your stuff.
I'm on a legecy Server and some stuff allready sells at NPC selling lvl on the market, some even below.. which doesn't make sense but I guess People don't check for the npc prieces...

[Aixa]

Argh why do you guys completely ignore the part of the income outcome of gil into the economy and only focus when i say to sell stuff to players. The gil is there, the guys running the dungeons arent generating it, other people are.

Even if dungeoneers arent going gil positive a lot of other players are. They will inject that gil into the economy and dungeoneers can get it out of the economy by interacting with it.

Edit due to post limit:
Okay, I'm posting here again. Ive been doing lv45 leves for my DoH. They give me 2000 gil per hq turn in (which i can do with nq mats) for probably less than 50 gil of repair cost to myself. I can do 12 of these a day for 12000 gil minted (leve reward) a day. With more materials I could gain 24000 gil per day using a different leve that takes more materials.

For these materials ive had to commision other DoHs, botanists, miner (for the other doh) and most of all battle classes to gather materials. At it stands im giving out about the full 2000 gil to the battle classes.

[Promethevs]

Same, missing the Point that way Money only gets moved from one Player to another, a part of it gets lost due to the fees, where does that Money come from the Player spents for your product?

I think you're the one missing the point. I sold to a vendor, not to a player.

Keep in mind too that in 1.0 leves gave just about the same amount of gil, and repairs at a merchant also took about the same amount of gil(which is 10x the numerical value you see now). During that time, the economy was pretty far from collapse still.

That being said, I'm not even saying that it's sufficient or that it's efficient or a desirable mode of play. However, hyperbole saying there's absolutely no way to make gil, that doesn't come from leves and doesn't come from players, won't get you anywhere.

[Iskander]

I see your point but I disagree slightly. The reason it's modeled this way is because people don't get a feeling of accomplishment from "relaxing." Dungeons and battles are supposed to be exciting and fun as well as rewarding; without the reward aspect there's no point to doing any of this.

There are plenty of accomplishments and rewarding experiences in the game. Such as being able to survive Titan Hard Mode or getting to Binding Coil. Having to mine 5000 items+ in every item just to get what I believe is the only blue pickaxe currently in the game for Miner. Saying that there is no reward without a game being modeled after rl is folly.

I disagree with this statement entirely. Can you please tell me why there is a problem to be required to do other things in-game to cover your dungeon running expenses?

Well for starters, we are going to remove the AH from the explanation, as the topic is economy money, not player transactions.

Player X has 4k gil in their pocket. This is after their 12 hr leves. They are high up in the lv 50 chart, so with decently damaged gear, it can cost around 2k to repair. Completely broken gear; 4k. They spend several hours gathering and are able to sell their gathers to a vendor for 500gil. If they dungeon, they may get 500gil for completion. That's a total of 1k gil. If they need to repair, they are looking at cutting into what little money they have. They will most likely be running everywhere, and La Noscea will be completely empty save new players since its completely sectioned off by ferry only transportation (meaning you can't just walk there, you have to pay to enter La Noscea).

Now, lets say the dev's make it so that a dungeon will reward the player with the cost of running said dungeon. So it costs 2-4k to repair your gear, and the dungeon run will make sure that those fees are taken care of. You are still not making a profit by running dungeons. You will still have people gathering/crafting/leves/fates/etc to make profit. However, making dungeon reward you with enough gil to break even allows players to not always be playing catch up and actually be able to enjoy the game.

[Deatheye]

I think you're the one missing the point. I sold to a vendor, not to a player.

Keep in mind too that in 1.0 leves gave just about the same amount of gil, and repairs at a merchant also took about the same amount of gil(which is 10x the numerical value you see now). During that time, the economy was pretty far from collapse still.

That being said, I'm not even saying that it's sufficient or that it's efficient or a desirable mode of play. However, hyperbole saying there's absolutely no way to make gil, that doesn't come from leves and doesn't come from players, won't get you anywhere.

Ok sry I've misread that. But that's somethign pretty wierd. I've never played an MORPG where it was usefull to sell anything to the NPC. Did you gather the ingredients for it yourself?

[Promethevs]

Ok sry I've misread that. But that's somethign pretty wierd. I've never played an MORPG where it was usefull to sell anything to the NPC. Did you gather the ingredients for it yourself?

Yeah, I mined and logged the cobalt & rosewood myself. I'll also say though, that I wouldn't be doing that except for the fact that I was leveling. I don't plan on playing that way long term lol