Warrior Rework to Balance the job

[CKNovel]

At this point I don't know how, nor do I care how you mentally compartmentalize that image of yourself while repeatedly saying balance doesn't matter. Either it matters or it doesn't, you can't have it both ways. If you cared about balance in dungeons, and you say you do, and you thought that Bloodwhetting to be overpowered/broken in dungeons, and you say you do, then the logical conclusion is to nerf bloodwhetting, whether or not that fixes healers or makes the dungeons engaging or not.

If that's your only logical conclusion, you lack vision, imagination and the ability to observe a design under multiple perspectives to fully understand the flaws and root of the problem.

Balance will never matter in dungeons, it's their purpose to be easily cleared while putting the minimum effort into it but it doesn't mean I don't care about the design&balance of dungeons.
Balancing jobs so they behave like good boys and good girls who stays in their lines is a mistake. Balancing dungeons themselves to make them more engaging is a preferable solution.

And since Balancing doesn't matter, it's good to have a few broken thing to break the usual pace of XIV.
My point is, seeking perfect job balancing will only sanitize the game and not make it engaging or fun. Tackling the balancing on the dungeon level can allow all jobs to be fun and engaging while not sanitizing the jobs.

Do you understand? It doesn't matter yet it doesn't mean I don't care.

[PyurBlue]

Personally, I LOVE getting Warrior tanks when I’m healing. It allows me to DPS more, killing mobs faster.

If you run out of OGCD's sure, though I find that to rarely happen if ever. DPS uptime is 100% reguardless of tank, WAR stands out because its self healing is so overtuned that by the time a WAR's HP is low enough to even consider any healing it jumps back to full. Other tanks at least benefit from a healer's presence.

And as a LONG time healer main who’s only recently started tanking seriously, I relish playing Warrior - it’s actually become my favorite melee job in the game, and Bloodwhetting is party of that experience.

I can understand liking the healing ability when soloing content, but that still breaks the game so it's not something that should be kept.

If people really want to keep Bloodwhetting as is then mobs need a tool to fight back against it. Amaurot has healing down enemies. If these were added to dungeons with increased healing down and focused on the tank that would go a long way to solving the problem. As long as the mobs causing the effect are around self healing could be reduced to a value like 1% and the tank would also benefit by having to think a little more about healing depending on what enemies are still alive.

In Dungeons, Normal mode and 24 man raid, tank buster deals miserable damages. Yet do we see a tank strike?
No, because tanks still have another role to fill.

FF14 is generally low difficulty. Things like TB's are weak in a lot of content and I'd like that to change. It won't address WAR making healers redundant in dungeons though.

Go back to my 24 man raid argument where Warrior isn't broken yet healing is still boring. I haven't seen a counter-argument yet.

Alliance raids aren't dungeons. Within dungeons a WAR tank makes the healer role redundant. That's a significant and game breaking problem that can't be fixed by making changings to alliance raids. Alliances also tend to focus more on party wide damage while dungeons do not. You're suggesting to change things to make dungeons the same way, but that only prompts me to ask why take away variety for the sake of a clearly overpowered class? Dungeon pulls are where a party member, the tank, takes a large constant stream of damage. It's a situation mostly unique to dungeons and it's a specific kind of healing that a healer can learn to engage in. Why take it away and double down on the game destroying its own mechanics? I see no good coming from it.

[Terhix]

If that's your only logical conclusion, you lack vision, imagination and the ability to observe a design under multiple perspectives to fully understand the flaws and root of the problem.

I'll grant you that, your solution to one job having one ability that blatantly overperforms on multi-pack pulls in dungeons being removing multi-pack pulls from the dungeons altogether so that using aoe abilities on any job, Warrior included, is a DPS loss, is truly imaginative.

[CKNovel]

Alliance raids aren't dungeons. Within dungeons a WAR tank makes the healer role redundant. That's a significant and game breaking problem that can't be fixed by making changings to alliance raids. Alliances also tend to focus more on party wide damage while dungeons do not. You're suggesting to change things to make dungeons the same way, but that only prompts me to ask why take away variety for the sake of a clearly overpowered class? Dungeon pulls are where a party member, the tank, takes a large constant stream of damage. It's a situation mostly unique to dungeons and it's a specific kind of healing that a healer can learn to engage in. Why take it away and double down on the game destroying its own mechanics? I see no good coming from it.

24 man raid are casual battle content. To not take it in account would be cherry-picking, exactly what this thread has been doing.
If you're still unhappy with it, then take in account criterion dungeon or deep dungeon like Eureka Orthos.

Take all data or take none, don't cherry-pick.

I don't get your point about "variety". Fates and Maps exist and use the exact same pattern. We would sacrifice nothing but gain more.

[Ramiee]

24 man raid are casual battle content. To not take it in account would be cherry-picking, exactly what this thread has been doing.
If you're still unhappy with it, then take in account criterion dungeon or deep dungeon like Eureka Orthos.

Take all data or take none, don't cherry-pick.

I don't get your point about "variety". Fates and Maps exist and use the exact same pattern. We would sacrifice nothing but gain more.

Why are you bringing up things besides dungeons, isn't PyurBlue only talking about dungeons.

[PyurBlue]

24 man raid are casual battle content. To not take it in account would be cherry-picking, exactly what this thread has been doing.

Where was I cherry picking? Dungeons work differently than other content and I think it's safe to say that is a design choice and generally accepted by the playerbase. WAR self healing is most problematic in dungeons so it's going to come up in a discussion on why WAR is problematic. Getting a WAR tank in high level roulettes is the least desirable outcome for me when healing and whatever happens in alliance or normal raids doesn't change that.

I'm editing this in to be extra clear. I don't think WAR healing is the only problem with healing at the moment and reducing WAR healing ability isn't meant to fix the entirety of healing. It's meant to fix a class that breaks the role system that FF14 is built around. Tanks that don't requiring healing spoil content where the healer is supposed to heal the tank. This has to be fixed as part of the greater effort to make healing as a whole more fun, unless rebuilding the entire game is being pushed as a realistic solution.