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  1. #1
    Player
    Amity_Roji's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2022
    Posts
    24
    Character
    Amity Nightshade
    World
    Coeurl
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Flappjax View Post
    ya'll don't know what you want.
    Yes we do. We want engaging healer gameplay.

    I think a lot of people are getting hung up on the "boring DPS rotation" angle. The fact - yes, fact - that healer gameplay at all levels of content is primarily focused around the pressing of a single DPS ability is a symptom of the problems with the healer role, not a cause. It is the end result of changes to both jobs and encounter design primarily beginning with ShB and worsening until we are at the place we are today.

    Many are in the "give healers more DPS abilities" camp because:
    • It's an easier change for Square Enix to make, as opposed to correcting all of the job and encounter stuff.
    • The issue is more acutely observed - that one-button DPS "rotation" is where healers spend most of their time and they're not thinking about why they're in that position.
    • Having more to do when leveling/questing/doing other solo activities would make it less painful.
    • They're not healer mains and don't want to upset the apple-cart.

    These are all fine and good points to make. However, this isn't addressing the real problem: healers spend very little time actually healing.

    Let me spell it out for you - that is a fact. It's not arguable. There are objective, quantifiable data points on this.

    The true causes are many and varied and can be argued all day. But here's my take on it, and these are common points:
    1. Other jobs - especially tanks - have had ever-increasing buffs to damage mitigation and self-healing.
    2. Healers are actually too powerful in their healing abilities.
    3. Encounter design doesn't involve many "heal checks" outside of the occasional party-wide or tank buster, and these are too easily dealt with because of points #1-2. In other words, there just isn't enough damage to heal through.
    4. Healer resource management (MP, job-specific resources, CDs) is almost entirely unnecessary.
    5. The devaluation of healing has allowed the meta to evolve accordingly (wall-pulling, encounter blitzing, etc.) and this has further contributed to healer devaluation in a self-reinforcing cycle.

    At this point we have to ask the obvious question - "What should healers be?" Again, this is debatable but I think these would be widely agreed upon by the healing community:
    • A healer's primary focus should be on using abilities to prevent party members from dying, either through mitigation or repair. This should require the majority of the healer's time and attention.
    • Healers should have a DPS kit that enables them to complete solo activities in a reasonable time and additionally allow them to provide supplemental DPS in encounters during "downtime" from healing.
    • As an innately supportive job, healers should have additional support abilities that improve the overall party synergistically.

    That's it.
    (21)

  2. #2
    Player
    WeakestZenosEnjoyer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2024
    Location
    Ul'dah
    Posts
    288
    Character
    Scrappy Moonlord
    World
    Halicarnassus
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 100
    So we've got the join date Oct 2015 that "joined at the end of ShB" and the "Sage main" with WAR and WHM on their profile claiming that the strike is bad while claiming the healer with the most complex damage rotation currently. (it's just Phlegma but it's more than everyone else lol)

    Really scraping the bottom of the barrel here.
    (17)

  3. #3
    Player
    KitiaraIornsight's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    141
    Character
    Kitiara Utmatar
    World
    Famfrit
    Main Class
    Sage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by WeakestZenosEnjoyer View Post
    So we've got the join date Oct 2015 that "joined at the end of ShB" and the "Sage main" with WAR and WHM on their profile claiming that the strike is bad while claiming the healer with the most complex damage rotation currently. (it's just Phlegma but it's more than everyone else lol)

    Really scraping the bottom of the barrel here.
    um, you do realize that someone can play this game and create their FORUM account much much later?
    Here's a snip of my oldest achievement if you don't believe my main character started in 2.1


    Forum membership does not get created automatically with the making of a character
    (4)

  4. #4
    Player
    Flay_wind's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    404
    Character
    Lily D'kryl
    World
    Shiva
    Main Class
    Dark Knight Lv 97
    Quote Originally Posted by KitiaraIornsight View Post
    um, you do realize that someone can play this game and create their FORUM account much much later?
    Here's a snip of my oldest achievement if you don't believe my main character started in 2.1


    Forum membership does not get created automatically with the making of a character
    Okay, a question then.
    What kind of content do you do on your Sage?
    (1)
    Sometimes rumors are just... rumors.

  5. #5
    Player
    KitiaraIornsight's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    141
    Character
    Kitiara Utmatar
    World
    Famfrit
    Main Class
    Sage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Flay_wind View Post
    Okay, a question then.
    What kind of content do you do on your Sage?
    Dungeons, trials, extreme trials, 8 man normal raids, 24 man raids, Variant, pretty much all of it. The only thing I've not done is all the extremes and savages because I am a mom and I work full time and I cannot commit to savage prog.
    What difference does it matter what content I do. The fact is I play on my sage the most when I play the game and will be progging the MSQ with sage through all story content.
    And now time to pull that gate keeping card out. Because I foresee you're going to try to claim I'm some how "too casual" of a player even though I've been playing the game since Beta on ps3 and the took a break and came back in 2014 and have maintained a sub with no lapse for nearly 10 years.....
    (2)
    Last edited by KitiaraIornsight; 06-20-2024 at 11:14 PM.

  6. #6
    Player
    Flay_wind's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    404
    Character
    Lily D'kryl
    World
    Shiva
    Main Class
    Dark Knight Lv 97
    Quote Originally Posted by KitiaraIornsight View Post
    Dungeons, trials, extreme trials, 8 man normal raids, 24 man raids, Variant, pretty much all of it. The only thing I've not done is extremes because I am a mom and I work full time and I cannot commit to savage prog.
    What difference does it matter what content I do. The fact is I play on my sage the most when I play the game and will be progging the MSQ with sage through all story content.
    And now time to pull that gate keeping card out. Because I foresee you're going to try to claim I'm some how "too casual" of a player even though I've been playing the game since Beta on ps3 and the took a break and came back in 2014 and have maintained a sub with no lapse for nearly 10 years.....
    Was mostly curious, since according to your lodestone achievements you do not have any on content EW EX (besides relatively recent Endsinger) clears, so yes, i could claim you're too casual, but that's beside point.
    Playing the game mostly for the story content is fine. But then why should you care about this strike?
    When Dawntrail is released you can go and complete MSQ on Sage, why suddenly come to forums and complaing about the strike, when as you claim it does not concern you and you will continue playing Sage just fine?
    (5)
    Sometimes rumors are just... rumors.

  7. #7
    Player
    KitiaraIornsight's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    141
    Character
    Kitiara Utmatar
    World
    Famfrit
    Main Class
    Sage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Flay_wind View Post
    Was mostly curious, since according to your lodestone achievements you do not have any on content EW EX (besides relatively recent Endsinger) clears, so yes, i could claim you're too casual, but that's beside point.
    Playing the game mostly for the story content is fine. But then why should you care about this strike?
    When Dawntrail is released you can go and complete MSQ on Sage, why suddenly come to forums and complaing about the strike, when as you claim it does not concern you and you will continue playing Sage just fine?
    And there's the gate keeping. So my opinion on a ridiculous strike and pointing out WHY its not going to accomplish what yall think it will because I don't do endgame savage content makes my opinion any less valid? The complaint is healers aren't fun, and here I am saying I find them fun. And so do most healer mains i know, including those of my friends who DO do the hard stuff.
    (2)

  8. #8
    Player
    Mimilu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    4,002
    Character
    Mimiji Miji
    World
    Exodus
    Main Class
    Pictomancer Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by KitiaraIornsight View Post
    um, you do realize that someone can play this game and create their FORUM account much much later?
    Here's a snip of my oldest achievement if you don't believe my main character started in 2.1


    Forum membership does not get created automatically with the making of a character
    Except the account WeakestZenosEnjoyer is replying to claims they started in Shadowbringers, which wasn't out until 2019. That character's forum account joined in October of 2015, 4 years before that expansion was released. (ಠ_ರೃ)
    (10)

  9. #9
    Player
    KitiaraIornsight's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    141
    Character
    Kitiara Utmatar
    World
    Famfrit
    Main Class
    Sage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Mimilu View Post
    Except the account WeakestZenosEnjoyer is replying to claims they started in Shadowbringers, which wasn't out until 2019. That character's forum account joined in October of 2015, 4 years before that expansion was released. (ಠ_ರೃ)
    uh, its very possible they tried the game, even maybe had a forum account from when they first tried the game.... left the game and came back during shadowbringers. Because well. that's also highly possible. The ONLY reason i don't play on my original beta account is because when I left after beta not really liking it anymore than the hellscape that was 1.0 is because i forgot my log in details and i no longer had access to my beta account/1.0 account.... soooooooooooooooooooooooo just because someone joined the forums in 2015 doesn't mean they fully stuck with it. I mean use common sense here, many people start the game and leave and unless they TELL SE to delete their account it stays, so they could recover it and come back much later and stick with the game.
    (0)

  10. #10
    Player
    Mimilu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    4,002
    Character
    Mimiji Miji
    World
    Exodus
    Main Class
    Pictomancer Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by KitiaraIornsight View Post
    uh, its very possible they tried the game, even maybe had a forum account from when they first tried the game.... left the game and came back during shadowbringers. Because well. that's also highly possible. The ONLY reason i don't play on my original beta account is because when I left after beta not really liking it anymore than the hellscape that was 1.0 is because i forgot my log in details and i no longer had access to my beta account/1.0 account.... soooooooooooooooooooooooo just because someone joined the forums in 2015 doesn't mean they fully stuck with it. I mean use common sense here, many people start the game and leave and unless they TELL SE to delete their account it stays, so they could recover it and come back much later and stick with the game.
    ...They're one of your alts, aren't they? (≖‿≖)
    (3)

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