the normal content is too easy

[kpxmanifesto]

They didn't choose to ignore it. They intentionally designed it that way. The "bottom of the bell curve player" spends just as much on their monthly sub as the top of the bell curve player. Making content for both ends of the curve is a wise decision. The bottom of the bell curve doesn't enjoy extreme and savage raiding, and that's OK. The top of the bell curve player may be bored with the MSQ fights, and that's OK. To each their own.

I'm gonna disagree on this. Sure you can make content for both ends of the curve, but when you make the final boss of an expansion (norm Thordan) still designed for bottom tier players, it makes the victory feel very hollow. Important MSQ boss fights should be balanced around the lowest common denominator - the average player. Not bottom tier players. Sprouts with no mmo experience aren't the average player.

[Ronduwil]

I'm gonna disagree on this. Sure you can make content for both ends of the curve, but when you make the final boss of an expansion (norm Thordan) still designed for bottom tier players, it makes the victory feel very hollow. Important MSQ boss fights should be balanced around the lowest common denominator - the average player. Not bottom tier players. Sprouts with no mmo experience aren't the average player.

With respect to the Heavensward expansion, they are. How many FFXIV vets in 2022 are still stuck on Thordan? Of those players, how many you would refer to as top tier? It's utterly ridiculous for you to state that sprout content from three expansions ago shouldn't be targeted at sprouts with no MMO experience.

[kpxmanifesto]

How many FFXIV vets in 2022 are still stuck on Thordan? Of those players, how many you would refer to as top tier?

Did I make any mention of this? Where are these questions coming from?

It's utterly ridiculous for you to state that sprout content from three expansions ago shouldn't be targeted at sprouts with no MMO experience.

Let's be real man. Not even sprouts struggle with Thordan.

[Silver-Strider]

With respect to the Heavensward expansion, they are. How many FFXIV vets in 2022 are still stuck on Thordan? Of those players, how many you would refer to as top tier? It's utterly ridiculous for you to state that sprout content from three expansions ago shouldn't be targeted at sprouts with no MMO experience.

How many people started as vets?

I was a total Noob to MMOs when I started in ARR. I struggled to complete some job quests (most notable being a Level 15 THM quest and the level 50 SMN). However, instead of whining and complaining things were too hard, I got good instead and by the end of ARR, I'd cleared coils. If a total noob was able to get thru the game back when it was actually hard, I fail to see the argument now.

[Ronduwil]

How mamy people started as vets?

I was a total Noob to MMOs when I started in ARR. I struggled to complete some job quests (most notable being a Level 15 THM quest and the level 50 SMN). However, instead of whining and complaining things were too hard, I got good instead and by the end of ARR, I'd cleared coils. If a total noob was able to get thru the game back when it was actually hard, I fail to see the argument now.

That was exactly my point. Players doing Thordan in 2022 aren't jaded FFXIV vets who are bored with the mechanics. They're perfectly happy with how it is. Players are still struggling to complete some job quests. I've had my share of wipes. Just the other day, I failed a Black Mage quest because I didn't see the giant meteors that spawned a golem who punched really hard. The lesson was learned. There was an easy mode option, but I didn't take it. I tried it again and succeeded. It felt great. The game is just fine. I didn't feel hollow and empty because the meteors were predictable and telegraphed. The difference between the job quest difficulty now and when you started is that you've gotten much better at the game than you were as a total noob to MMOs.

[Ath192]

That was exactly my point. Players doing Thordan in 2022 aren't jaded FFXIV vets who are bored with the mechanics. They're perfectly happy with how it is. Players are still struggling to complete some job quests. I've had my share of wipes. Just the other day, I failed a Black Mage quest because I didn't see the giant meteors that spawned a golem who punched really hard. The lesson was learned. There was an easy mode option, but I didn't take it. I tried it again and succeeded. It felt great. The game is just fine. I didn't feel hollow and empty because the meteors were predictable and telegraphed. The difference between the job quest difficulty now and when you started is that you've gotten much better at the game than you were as a total noob to MMOs.

So why do we have noobs quitting? I have 2 friends quit on me personally after they couldnt find anything fun about the gameplay in all of ARR and beginning of HW. Gameplay. Not story.

[HyoMinPark]

So why do we have noobs quitting? I have 2 friends quit on me personally after they couldnt find anything fun about the gameplay in all of ARR and beginning of HW. Gameplay. Not story.

Basically this. I’ve seen several complaints from new players about how boring gameplay is at the lower levels. From the forums to in Cactuar’s Novice Network.

[Ath192]

Basically this. I’ve seen several complaints from new players about how boring gameplay is at the lower levels. From the forums to in Cactuar’s Novice Network.

Heck, I would've quit too. NGL. I had the blessing of playing most of the content of this game as it was coming out and fresh because the experience was more challenging and fulfilling. We have people coming into this game who have to spend dozens of hours hitting 2 buttons on their hotbar with vets not even saying a word to them and bulldozing through content regardless of whether they die or get left behind.

If anything I think the current nerfed content is catering to jaded old vet players who dont want to talk or teach people and just want to watch youtube while they grind their tomestones for crappy rewards over and over again. And they don't want to bother themselves having to explain any mechanics or interacting with noobs so they can be part of the team and clear content together just because they themselves have already done it before.

That doesn't sound like fun to me. I don't think it sounds like fun if I were a noob. It's just depressing. If I described it to you this way before you bought it would you still buy this game? And the thing is I wouldn't be lying to you.

[Jojoya]

So why do we have noobs quitting? I have 2 friends quit on me personally after they couldnt find anything fun about the gameplay in all of ARR and beginning of HW. Gameplay. Not story.

What previous gaming experience did your friends have and which genres did they prefer?

That's where some of the problems come in. Some new players have extensive gaming experience when they start this game. Some have none.

Or it could be your friends just don't like the "JRPG in a MMO" experience regardless of what games they've played in the past.

[Ath192]

What previous gaming experience did your friends have and which genres did they prefer?

That's where some of the problems come in. Some new players have extensive gaming experience when they start this game. Some have none.

Or it could be your friends just don't like the "JRPG in a MMO" experience regardless of what games they've played in the past.

Lifelong gamers really, played MMOs like DAOC, Aion, super mario RPG was one of their favorites, sometimes shooters, league, ARK, some FFs, just got done with Elden ring, sometimes strategy games, huge fans of pokemon, zelda. They watch anime. They're not the discriminatory type when it comes to games.

But you know after they played a good 50 hours or so they just stopped logging on and when I asked they told me it was boring AF. I told them it got really good later and they told me they shouldn't have to put in hundreds of hours to see a good fight. I didn't push them any further they were gone.

I can probably tell you if the roulettes were min ilvl and maybe we had the original experience of the ARR expert dungeons and Crystal Tower, WoD they wouldve found it fun. But they just ran following the crowds that barely moved and just spammed buttons in the raids and all they did in dungeons was spam their 3 or 4 buttons and nothing was ever dangerous per se.

Quite honestly as we played the amount of excuses I kept having to make for the game even made me realize wow.... this sucks for new players.