FFXIV is too simplistic and bland

[Payadopa]

yeah I'm gonna go ahead and say your opinion is pretty much worthless if you think XIV is in any way, shape, or form, simpler than the older final fantasy games.

Tastes are subjective but that's not even up to debate at this point. The combo and subjob system in XI alone are way more thought-provoking than XIV. /shrug

[Payadopa]

Don't let someone who is fishing hear that ...

You go me there. Haha

[Shurrikhan]

There was a time when
There was a time when
There was a time when
There was a time when
There was a time when
There was a time when
There was a time when

And yet none of those things are true now, so why would we say that a more involved or fleshed out open world experience, for instance, requires a lack of QoL features or painfully long grinds?

Considering I wasn't even able to make it out of the level 20 area for lack of being able to find leveling parties yes, it did impact my enjoyment of the game lol.

And again, is that because the game was fundamentally dependent on lack of QoL features, or was that just a failing of the time (that has since been addressed)?

Does "Open World is relevant for more than just as long as it takes to do the relevant MSQ and, if thus obliged, grind its limited rewards" = "You can't get past level 20" ?

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

And yet none of those things are true now, so why would we say that a more involved or fleshed out open world experience, for instance, requires a lack of QoL features or painfully long grinds?



And again, is that because the game was fundamentally dependent on lack of QoL features, or was that just a failing of the time (that has since been addressed)?

Does "Open World is relevant for more than just as long as it takes to do the relevant MSQ and, if thus obliged, grind its limited rewards" = "You can't get past level 20" ?

The problem there is, people tend to tell you xi was only good during that era, and that all of the qol ruined the game. So yes, I'm basing my experience off of what people say was xis best.

[FeliAiko]

Why should people entertain the talking points of someone who is posting on a lvl 25 alt?

No-one's forcing people to entertain anything. If you don't like the point/thread, ignore it and move on. Don't get why people think replying with comments like 'lol lvl25 alt who cares' actually does anything beyond proving they got bothered enough to respond to a thread they supposedly don't care about.

You don't have to be at endgame to recognise how basic XIV's gearing system is, or how repetitive their dungeon format is, when it's hardly any different at lower levels. I mean, you can still like the game in spite of these things, but let's not act like because someone isn't at endgame any criticisms raised about XIV are automatically void.

[Gameovers]

No-one's forcing people to entertain anything. If you don't like the point/thread, ignore it and move on. Don't get why people think replying with comments like 'lol lvl25 alt who cares' actually does anything beyond proving they got bothered enough to respond to a thread they supposedly don't care about.

You don't have to be at endgame to recognise how basic XIV's gearing system is, or how repetitive their dungeon format is, when it's hardly any different at lower levels. I mean, you can still like the game in spite of these things, but let's not act like because someone isn't at endgame any criticisms raised about XIV are automatically void.

I disagree, I think you do need to be at endgame to comment on how endgame needs to be changed and whatnot. If you're not doing the content then you shouldn't have any opinion on it what so ever. I'm still going thur MSQ and about to hit endgame. Tho yes I read the forums you don't see me asking for things to be changed before I even hit the content. That's like asking the food store to change the flavors before you even try out said food. Noone will take you seriously and they shouldn't.

[Melichoir]

No-one's forcing people to entertain anything. If you don't like the point/thread, ignore it and move on. Don't get why people think replying with comments like 'lol lvl25 alt who cares' actually does anything beyond proving they got bothered enough to respond to a thread they supposedly don't care about.

You don't have to be at endgame to recognise how basic XIV's gearing system is, or how repetitive their dungeon format is, when it's hardly any different at lower levels. I mean, you can still like the game in spite of these things, but let's not act like because someone isn't at endgame any criticisms raised about XIV are automatically void.

OP specifically mentions level 80 content, and speaks about it as though theyve been doing it, but are instead making a long wall of text with a lvl 25 alt. And that is being charitable. Why make this choice and why should anyone humor someone who wont even post with a character that is level 80 so that we can take the criticisms seriously, particularly if they referencing end game content.

Ive no problem addressing the points, but will only do so if I can see we're gonna have a serious conversation with someone whos actually invested time and effort into playing the game. But your position seems to be "Shut up unless you take their points seriously!" despite not even knowing if theyve participated in said content theyre criticizing. If the OP wants to have a serious conversation, post on their 80 and lets see what theyve been up to. Otherwise either this really is just a sprout talking out their butt or a troll looking to waste time.

[FeliAiko]

OP specifically mentions level 80 content, and speaks about it as though theyve been doing it, but are instead making a long wall of text with a lvl 25 alt. And that is being charitable. Why make this choice and why should anyone humor someone who wont even post with a character that is level 80 so that we can take the criticisms seriously, particularly if they referencing end game content.

Ive no problem addressing the points, but will only do so if I can see we're gonna have a serious conversation with someone whos actually invested time and effort into playing the game. But your position seems to be "Shut up unless you take their points seriously!" despite not even knowing if theyve participated in said content theyre criticizing. If the OP wants to have a serious conversation, post on their 80 and lets see what theyve been up to. Otherwise either this really is just a sprout talking out their butt or a troll looking to waste time.

Don't understand why whether they post on a main or alt makes a difference. It's either you agree with their points or you don't. If someone says that raid boss attacks are heavily scripted, that statement doesn't become incorrect because they posted it on a lvl10 account.

My position is if you don't like the thread/content, ignore it and move on. All you people that feel inclined to respond with comments like 'I don't care, your opinion is irrelevant', 'lol troll look at their character level' etc. do is just help keep the thread alive, or show you can't respond to criticism rationally but only emotionally. Then you wonder why the OF ends up getting troll posts (that you also end up replying to, giving the person the reaction they were looking for)

[Gameovers]

Don't understand why whether they post on a main or alt makes a difference. It's either you agree with their points or you don't. If someone says that raid boss attacks are heavily scripted, that statement doesn't become incorrect because they posted it on a lvl10 account.

My position is if you don't like the thread/content, ignore it and move on. All you people that feel inclined to respond with comments like 'I don't care, your opinion is irrelevant', 'lol troll look at their character level' etc. do is just help keep the thread alive, or show you can't respond to criticism rationally but only emotionally. Then you wonder why the OF ends up getting troll posts (that you also end up replying to, giving the person the reaction they were looking for)

The problem with people who comment on stuff they didn't do or posting on an alt account is simply untrustable. Like how do you know thats what they think and they aren't just reposting stuff they heard? Even if it is true the person wouldn't know that. You and I may know that but the person saying it doesn't know that which makes their debate void. They can't talk about it cause they only have info from other people and not from their own experience. And if they are at endgame but posting on an alt it just looks fishy. Why post on an alt and make your thread or comment look fishy? Cause no matter how you slice it it looks odd complaining about endgame and we all see a level 25 character. Let me spin this another way. you're level 80. Lets say you come and make a thread saying that endgame is too easy. you're at 80 so sure.. but we look at your profile and see you didn't unlock anything at endgame. You just finished the MSQ and came here and said "Endgame is too easy." Are we supposed to take your word and seriously debate it like you know this? That's why posting on your main matters when you're talking about content. I cannot say endgame is -whatever- because I have not unlocked endgame yet. And until we find out otherwise that's what the OP is doing.

[Melichoir]

Don't understand why whether they post on a main or alt makes a difference. It's either you agree with their points or you don't. If someone says that raid boss attacks are heavily scripted, that statement doesn't become incorrect because they posted it on a lvl10 account.

Because it shows that theyve dealt with the subject matter on hand and want to have a serious conversation about it. This is important when the crux of the OP's thoughts rely on end game stuff and with that alt (if it is), they havent seen end game. If the conversation started was talking about how slow FFXIV is at low levels, and how there needs to be some changes to the early game, Id respond to that and give my thoughts. But therye not referencing just htat, theyre referencing content they cant have participated on with the character listed.

Furthermore, I did not say that their points were invalid because they were level 25, I said that there is no need to justify responses to someone posting on a lvl 25 character with mediocre gear and no other classes even leveled particularly if theyre referencing end game content as a big part of their criticisms, because there is a strong likelyhood the poster is either:

A) A sprout who hasnt actually been a part of the content theyre criticizing and are regurgitating talking points theyve read without actually experiencing or understanding the nuance behind them. This makes having a good conversation almost non existance cause they simply dont know what theyre talking to a degree that actually matters

-or-

B) Theyre a troll using an alt to get people riled up and waste time debating parts of the game that they have no actual desire to debate, which makes taking a ton of time offering counterpoints or thoughts on their criticisms a waste of time cause the OP never intended to take a conversation seriously to begin with.

If the OP wants to have a serious conversation, show that theyre a serious player. They dont have to be a savage tier raider or anything. Just make the post with at least a level 80 that has seen the end game content theyre referencing so we can atleast see that theyve actually done what theyre criticizing. Otherwise, why bother posting on an alt? What would be the motive behind that?

My position is if you don't like the thread/content, ignore it and move on. All you people that feel inclined to respond with comments like 'I don't care, your opinion is irrelevant', 'lol troll look at their character level' etc. do is just help keep the thread alive, or show you can't respond to criticism rationally but only emotionally. Then you wonder why the OF ends up getting troll posts (that you also end up replying to, giving the person the reaction they were looking for)

So it is literally "Shut up unless youre gonna address the points." I mean you can phrase it nicely by saying "Ignore and move on" but it still boils down to "Dont say anything unless you plan on discussing the issue." Which completely ignores my point: Why is anyone taking what the OP is saying seriously given the nature of the OP's posting character? Should people really be humoring someone who supposedly wants to hve a serious discussion about the game but wont make the post with atleast a level 80 that demonstrates theyve participated in some extent to the content theyre criticizing?

This isnt even an emotional response, its a rational one. It wasnt "Lol Noob Git Gud You dont know n-e-thing." It was poitning out that the OP purposefully made the post with a lvl 25 alt with very little going on. This raises questions about the motives of the OP and how serious they are about having the conversation. And me pushing back is because I believe humoring either players who have invested very little in the game making criticisms by regurgitating talking points theyve read without the basic experience of going through it, or the fact we have troll posters who resurrect dead threads or copy/paste crap from years ago and have no interest in a real conversation will just lead to more toxicity long term. Keep in mind Im spending more time replying to you than the OP, and I didnt reply to the OP till page 8 or 10