This is why this game should'nt get a parse

[MoroMurasaki]

How in the hell is this even a thread?

'Parsers are bad because I'm embarrassed I was outdpsed by tanks who were mean to me'

Really? Is this what people are complaining about now? Send those tanks my way, I'd love to get a WAR in Shin who didn't plop down in Defiance and stay there.

[Tridus]

'Parsers are bad because I'm embarrassed I was outdpsed by tanks who were mean to me'

I'm still trying to figure out how these people intend to solve the problem without a parser, aside from "go into a different group and hope they can carry me".

If you don't have enough DPS to properly clear the encounter, your only two options to try and fix it are :
1. Improve your DPS, for which you need data
2. Quit and hope that hope in the next group, other people already did #1

All we're getting by keeping it unofficial is that some players have more access to it than others, which in a game that's so DPS focused isn't terribly fair.

[Galgarion]

My refreshing late thread take on this subject: People are already exclusionist dicks in this game without benefit of an official parser. Elitists gonna be elitists. Why blame the X-ray when it's the tumor you should be mad at? As long as you surround yourself with good people with good morals, you won't have to deal with the pricks. Go out and find them.

[Zojha]

1. Improve your DPS, for which you need data

So you spam random buttons and then just remember the combo that put out the most damage according to the parser?
Because the only thing the parser tells you is how much damage you have put out with a given combination of buttons. It does not tell you what might be a better combination of buttons.

So your only recourse is to try a different combination of buttons. But which one? The parser doesn't give you any hints. Your options to improve now are to mash buttons at random, for example by throwing a cat on the keyboard, guessing or simply copying someone else, or systematically analyze your skills and mathematically optimize potency per second. But if you do the latter, you already got the solution to your issue without a parser and the parser can only help you double check your math by giving you differing results if you fauxed up or confirming what you already knew if you didn't.

If anyone seriously tells me they need to parse Spinning Edge - Gust Slash - Aeolian Edge in all possible order combinations and compare the output of each in order to realize this order is giving the best results, I struggle to take them seriously. The math naturally gets more complex over time, but the principle doesn't change.
So please don't credit parsers for more than they are worth. They are useful monitoring and control tools that help you spot deficiencies, especially in live situations where your mind is often busy with things other than analyzing your performance. A lot like recording a fight, really. And much like you can look at a random world first video and try to copy what they do action by action, you can look at parses and copy someone performing better than you action by action. But those people most likely didn't get there by mashing random buttons either.

[akaneakki]

So you spam random buttons and then just remember the combo that put out the most damage according to the parser?

I'm not sure where to start with this setence...

[lulunami]

I'm not sure where to start with this setence...

From I can infer, Zojha is saying the best way to be good at DPS is to read and analyze the tooltips on the skills available. You look at the potencies, effects, durations, and cooldowns of each skill. Then you will know what is the best button to press for a given situation. Reading a guide can make this process a lot shorter since they calculate a lot of the math out for you. You can practice on a striking dummy(s) to make muscle memory easier.

Parsers can give a player the wrong idea since there is so much damage variance for a given run compared to another one. You would need to do something like 1000 sample runs to get an average expected value.

I feel that you cannot make people do stuff they do not want to do. Players that want help/advice will seek out aid out of their own volition. Criticism/suggestions from external sources will not necessarily make people want to improve. People that want to improve are already motivated to do that on their own.

[Tridus]

I feel that you cannot make people do stuff they do not want to do. Players that want help/advice will seek out aid out of their own volition. Criticism/suggestions from external sources will not necessarily make people want to improve. People that want to improve are already motivated to do that on their own.

But you have to realize there's a problem before you seek out help/advice. When you can simply be carried through most of the content in the game there doesn't appear to be any problem. It only slaps you when you hit an enrage or a group where everything takes forever, and then said players are more likely to blame everyone else.

The game never tells you if you're part of the problem, and why seek out advice if you think everything's fine and it's just everyone else that is bad?

[MoroMurasaki]

The game never tells you if you're part of the problem, and why seek out advice if you think everything's fine and it's just everyone else that is bad?

This flashes me back to your recent Keeper of the Lake disband.

At one point someone in the party was parsing and one DPS was doing more DPS on the final boss than the rest of the party combined. That means that other DPS (and tank and healer imo) have gotten to 50 on their selected roles without ever having to do a respectable amount of DPS.

Now if at the end of every dungeon a big F showed up on the screen for them with an overlay of "this was your dps, this is the usual expected dps for your job in this instance" that showed them they were missing key skill/gear upgrades maybe that group would have cleared.

[Floraxa]

-snip

Yes, this is called trial and error, something used in medicine, all scientific fields, mathematics, etc. This is generally used because people aren't simply given the answer so they test any and all combinations of processes to find the best result. The parser is a tool, not an answer, don't treat it like one. It simply gives you the information and you use it how you will to improve. Sure, you can copy someone from a world first parse but you aren't them, you won't perfectly copy them. If you truly believe that something designed to give information should also give you the answer, you have fully misunderstood the purpose of a parser.

[Tridus]

So your only recourse is to try a different combination of buttons. But which one? The parser doesn't give you any hints. Your options to improve now are to mash buttons at random, for example by throwing a cat on the keyboard, guessing or simply copying someone else, or systematically analyze your skills and mathematically optimize potency per second. But if you do the latter, you already got the solution to your issue without a parser and the parser can only help you double check your math by giving you differing results if you fauxed up or confirming what you already knew if you didn't.

And how do you know if you did the analysis correctly without data to test it? How do you know if you copied someone else correctly, or if the person you're copying from even knows what they're talking about without data to test it?

Oh, wait. Sounds like you need a parser to have visibility into what's working and what isn't, which is exactly what I said in the first place.

You think those world firsts and people coming up with the rotations and stat priorities everyone is copying did it without any parsers?