Built-in Parsers

[Dualgunner]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-WXYg-S05U

Likely referring to 6:04, where Yoshi said they aren't allowed because of things like hacks, so the company has to officially decline.

However, he's telling the players don't sub your mod in people's face. If you aren't telling people you're parsing, nobody is going to know 100% you are parsing. He wants people to enjoy their experience, and if parsing gives the player the full experience, they can, so long as they aren't rude about it.

"doesn't make too big of a difference in
6:46terms of like giving users an advantage
6:48or not um he feels that what's most
6:50important is on this the actual skill of
6:53the player themselves and in terms of
6:58like different tools that are being used
7:01or that has come across like um like
7:06hacking tool or like thoughts that would
7:08do menial tasks for you or generate Gil
7:11for you those are definitely not good
7:14and we would have to go in and ban those
7:16people that are abusing the system um"

Based on the transcript of the video linked, he is talking about botting and actual hacks as a separate entity entirely to a program like ACT. If this is what Big Red is referring to, then he's off by a mile and "hacks" are absolutely not a reason they won't do an official parser.

Imho as long as we find it acceptable to rank all jobs based purely on damage they do, we as a community do not deserve an official parse. Now i have been pugging all the content since 2.0 and i have never once hit enrage with a 100% clean run.

From what I'm understanding, your argument is:

Parsers lead to comparisons between the jobs
Comparisons between the jobs lead to ranking
Ranking is bad
Therefore parsers are bad?

The flaw here is the ranking happens with or without a parser. We have 3 tanks for 2 spots, 3 healers for 2 spots, and 9 dps for 4 spots. People are gonna rank what the best things to bring will be in the long run even without solid numbers.

And with the parser and the rankings we're able to have an open dialogue with the devs about balance, and showcase what the real numbers are versus what the devs may want / may have predicted.

EDIT: I can get where you're coming from that ranking purely on DPS can be shortsighted; there are things that don't show on the parser like rDPS and that can skew the idea of what a job is actually bringing. But all other things equal as we must assume for Occam's Razor (player skill, mechanics followed, etc) we still inevitably wind up with the question of "Which jobs help us kill this faster?" And whether we answer that quantitatively with parsers or qualitatively without is irrelevant.

[Deceptus]

No support. We don't need more reasons for people to start kicking people out of groups just because a number was lacking in THEIR own opinion. I know what your reasoning is behind wanting it added, but people without a doubt would use it to just be crap to other players. We've seen it before, we'll see it again.

This line makes no sense. For example, the 2nd boss of Rabanaster. When the spheres spawn you have a certain time limit to destroy them, aka the dreaded DPS check. IIRC someone did the math and it was around 2800 combined dps.

If your alliance is consistently NOT killing the sphere, someone isn't pulling their weight for one reason or another and you'll only be able to tell that with a parser.

They are tool, nothing more. And like any tool they can be used for good or bad.

[LastFireAce]

We already got in game Parsers, go outside Idyshire or Reach and kill thos dummy.

[BillyKaplan]

If your alliance is consistently NOT killing the sphere, someone isn't pulling their weight for one reason or another and you'll only be able to tell that with a parser.

And then what? You'll kick them? What if the healers kept letting them die and they're constantly with Brink of Death, which butchers their numbers? Will you kick the healers too? Where will this end?

[Dualgunner]

And then what? You'll kick them? What if the healers kept letting them die and they're constantly with Brink of Death, which butchers their numbers? Will you kick the healers too? Where will this end?

It never ends. Eventually the whole 24 man will have been kicked and the last person in there will just vote abandon. That is all that will ever happen in 24 mans ever again in this post-parser-pocalypse.

We already got in game Parsers, go outside Idyshire or Reach and kill thos dummy.

Page 2 is thataway. Already covered in this thread.

[Taika]

"Know Strat or get kicked. No parser=kick"

And so what? There already are "high DPS and kick" and "1 mistake and kick" party finders. Everyone is allowed to start any kind of party finders they want, and everyone is free to join or not to join them as they wish.

[Ilan]

We already got in game Parsers, go outside Idyshire or Reach and kill thos dummy.

It shows you that you can beat up a dummy in a certain time but it doesn't show you if you and your rotation works in an actual fight. So no you are wrong.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

I can see the New PF strap lines now

"Know Strat or get kicked. No parser=kick"

Do you honestly think players like that aren't running ACT? They just won't say why they're abruptly kicking you, but they will still do it. In fact, a common tactic for low DPS groups is to disband and re-invite the good players.

[BigRed5392]

Got any evidence to back that claim up Big Red? Since its just a little research should be easy to go and cite it really quick.

I was having net issues, but anyone and everyone had a chance to watch any and all live letters. they are archived on both youtube and the forums.
this post and suggestion has come up over 12 times since ARR. A forum search, and google of the live letters would bring up info. People are so keen for others to research content in ff14 with just "google it" as a tip, don't be shocked when others suggest the same for repeat topics.

Yoshida is sick of seeing parser requests that he also noped out from a live letter at an event.

[BigRed5392]

How do you know how well you're doing without actual numbers to back it up? There are so many players out there who think they're doing alright but in reality don't have a clue. And if you say read and follow the guides for openers and rotations, you know they're all based on people utilising parsers to find that information, right?

What's so scary and wrong about actually knowing how you're doing and why in the content where certain numbers simply need to be met or the whole group will fail?

Also going to ask you the same question: are you even doing the content people need the parsers for? Seems like this thread is full of people saying "oh no you don't need a parser, you just have to X", while those people have no personal experience of the content where the parsers are used and needed... I'm all for implementing an official parser which is limited for the optional use of premade parties (and the content those do: extremes, savage, ultimate). In this case, having one in game doesn't in any way even concern those players who don't do that content in the first place (like many naysayers in this thread).

I've played dcuo which DOES have an ingame parser, and can tell you it didn't do what you want. Which is make people learn, so you are not wiping to content.

I think Parsers are the worst way to tell if you are good or not, as being good is more then just how high your dps is, i see groups wipe due to healers being too scared to heal worried about over healing.

I see people step on each others toes to do the big D deeps, instead of working as a team. Like a healer who holy spams during blood price, or who doesn't cure till the very last min.

MMO have been out longer then parsers and other third party tools. I don't recall the EQ crowd ever having parser conversations, I don't recall parsers coming up in ff11 till 2008. I only heard of them in WoW, and personaly experienced them in dcuo.

the parser in dcuo, tells you in and outgoing damage, crit rate, healing output. It never made people better, just made people rush content so they can top dps. Most ppl didn't want to do their role. Just dps.

I see that happening here with the need for all tanks/healers to deal big d damage no matter the content. yet dps players are not told to do extra like heal/raise when its part of their kit like rdm. I rarely see people use skills that aid parties, such as enmity reducers since it deals no damage.


And to reply your question, yes i do content which it is "needed", and never once got complaints if my damage is low, and i DF/PF content not in a static. I did coil around its launch, sadly had no time to do savage alex, but i did do the extremes.

to be good at the game, you simply need to be in good gear and know the job/role you are playing. You can train out in the world to see how each skill works with others to fine tune your rotations. You can simply use time to try and kill mobs faster each time.

As i said parser were not always around, how do you think older mmo players managed? ff11 was ps2 only @ launch, how do you think those players "got good".