Alienation of Dedicated and Skilled players

[Caelum_Dragguell]

you won't be able to respec it for 3.4 and 3.5. Meaning what you choose now is the kind of stats that you'll be rocking. Should I have my one and only 120 accuracy to miss less? Should I go for critical? Should I go for piety?All of these have very different side effects and very different playstyles that I need to consider.

Do tell me what different play-styles stem from our current secondary stats. The way things are now for everything but healers there are 2 secondary stats that if it were possible, everyone would only use them over all else. What side effect is there? the change is subtle and boring. Only on healers is there even a slight sense of freedom in the customization of your stats. As someone who's played all roles and nearly all classes I can confidently say that CRIT + (Insert one other stat here depending on class) is all we have for everything else.

So much variety huh...

[mirta000]

@Caelum
Piety if you want to not ask for bard song
Crit if you want good shields
Accuracy if instead of worrying about piety you'll DPS
Det > SS as far as I know, however it's not everything else > det either.

Also example of how cookie cutter builds made everyone's life hard - remember STR tanks?

[Caelum_Dragguell]

Strength tanking was the result of the current raid meta of the time. Gordias had such strict DPS checks that in order to accomplish them at lower Ilv's Strength tanking was an absolute necessity for progression. Even Healers had to participate in DPS in order to get through them. This only occurred because the Dev team heard that the raid scene wanted something significantly harder than Final Coil, and when they heard "Harder raid" they thought that making DPS checks rigorous was the option. If you participated in raid content then you'd understand where that meta came from. In order to do it well one had to actually know how to perform that playstyle correctly. Many did not thus Vitality tanking would have been a better option.

also since when did this thread become specifically about stats, that's only one part of the problem, I just want more meaningful content as a whole that will keep me occupied for more than one week after a patch releases. Let me reiterate, in no way would I want to be taking anything away from anyone. All I keep hearing is, "oh but if you change this the world will end" or "oh but adding new content on top of what we have is bad" or "well changing the formula we've had for the past 4 years which is boring a lot of players is a terrible idea". Can we take a moment and just MAYBE... MAYBE consider that the game is on the BRINK of being something AMAZING but it just doesn't have that final amount of depth needed to make it reach that point? (Someone stated they felt this way too previously)

[mirta000]

how do you imagine content that would keep you preoccupied then? I come from MMOs where I ran the same dungeons over and over for 2 years honestly and majority of differences in content where guild created.

And yeah, I was part of the raids at that point. STR was only that required if you were heading for world's first. If you waited a week or two for people to gear up, then tanks ran a mix between vit and str. However dungeon roulette tanking was at all time low because people who couldn't run the build, still ran the build.

[Caelum_Dragguell]

I think the point I want to make here is that no one told them they should put on all STR accessories, I personally did a mix, No one urged them to run a STR build. That was their choice. It benefited some players and hurt others who thought they could pull it off.

Also Dungeon roulette? really? those don't dictate much. you can run the dungeons that were out at the time in i150 and be fine.

The problems you state come from player incompetence which is an entirely different issue altogether and unrelated to the topic at hand.

[Ryel]

Also example of how cookie cutter builds made everyone's life hard - remember STR tanks?

This is a poor example.

The only thing STR tanks did was highlight the differences in player skill, There are just as many bad VIT tanks as there were STR tanks and vice versa. However, the same principles that applied to STR tanking then still apply now in that excess HP is effectively meaningless in most content the difference is that currently we no longer have the option of getting rid of the excess HP in favor of more damage (which was helping the party btw), or at the very least not to the degree we could before.

If the devs had really wanted to open up play-style variety concerning STR versus VIT tanks and offer players meaningful choices when it comes to engaging content they could have designed battles accordingly, but they didn't.

Lack of gear and stat variety makes a boring game in the long term and out of the stats we're currently offered the devs have made sure that the only ones that really matter when it comes to content completion are main stat and accuracy which shouldn't be the case, it's even gotten to the point where we have certain stats that are near useless in value like parry.

There is really no reason to not offer stat variety other than the fact that it takes development time (but they want to keep the 3 patch cycle) and that they want the majority of content to remain "casual" friendly (high completion rate, low time investment) which reinforces their "theme park" philosophy.

It is not because stat variety and unique stats are a flawed concept.

[SDaemon]

Strength tanking was the result of the current raid meta of the time.

XIV's DPS meta is a result of the battle system and how battles play out in regards to outgoing damage. Tanks and Healers have always been expected to contribute to DPS. Gordias just escalated it to new heights. The only reason the STR Tank meta has subsided is because STR and VIT are more in line with each other in regards to tank DPS. Though some tanks still meld for STR where applicable.

[mirta000]

I think the point I want to make here is that no one told them they should put on all STR accessories, I personally did a mix, No one urged them to run a STR build. That was their choice. It benefited some players and hurt others who thought they could pull it off.

Also Dungeon roulette? really? those don't dictate much. you can run the dungeons that were out at the time in i150 and be fine.

The problems you state come from player incompetence which is an entirely different issue altogether and unrelated to the topic at hand.

it's very much related to the topic at hand. You're suggesting exposing the population to more possible goof ups for the benefit of varied builds, completely disregarding that it will prevent legitimate players from completing content when they're grouped with a worse off player, or the fact that worse off players will always go for cookie cutter builds no matter they're able to play it or not.

[Caelum_Dragguell]

Some Players will always be bad regardless of how good their stats are, or how high their ILVL is because they never put in the time to actually develop enough skill to play well. Also, please play all roles before making assumptions on game mechanics. The idea that everyone is on an even playing field in our current game is illogical in itself. There will always be a skill divide and that's a fact.

Sorry but if you've ever played any game before, "There's always a bigger fish".

again stats don't play into skill.

[Dextro]

TLDR:
"Everything should remain exactly as it is; nothing is broken, don't fix anything, the people who want change are the minority - don't listen to them! Let the game stagnate!"

Let's wrap this thread up and focus on the real issues at hand....

I feel like I don't have enough /doze and /sit variations as a lala.
Please SE, I need to look as adorable as possible while i lounge around waiting for the release of more content.