Why are low standards for dps acceptable?

[Ciri_Wolf]

Well this thread is less about the OP and more about the community standards. Unless the players stop overreacting, being bad and start treating the randoms in DF like people, topics like this one are going to flourish.

Seems half it is like that. Just find it interesting that people are arguing opinions for over 50 pages xD

[Whiteroom]

Seems half it is like that. Just find it interesting that people are arguing opinions for over 50 pages xD

First time on the internet?

The internet is pretty much one part arguing, one part food and cat pictures, and one part porn.

[Lemuria]

Without Enochian up, you CANNOT perform your level 60 rotation as it allows you to use Fire IV and Blizzard IV. It's not an ability you can simply forget to use.

Enochian's rotation is fairly situational for a few reasons:

- Both Fire IV and Blizzard IV have longer cast times than other spells. These are not spells you can cast if you need to dodge quickly, and missing a spell in your rotation hurts your overall DPS far greater than other spells.
- Fire IV can only be cast under Astral Fire's effect, and does not renew the timer. You need to use other fire spells or ice spells to keep up the chain.
- Mis-timing your Blizzard IV (or having it interrupted) can mean losing Enochian's effect.
- Fire IV and Blizzard IV are both single-target spells. They're mostly useless on trash groups, and best reserved for bosses or tougher trash.

Now, having Enochian's effect boosts all your damage, so it's nice to have up by default, but the level 60 'rotation' is situational, and not something you would use all the time. Certainly not for most trash pulls, since you'd only get a few spells off before you move onto the next group.

[TheUltimateSeph]

Seems half it is like that. Just find it interesting that people are arguing opinions for over 50 pages xD

Or just keep going and see if we can get this thread up to 70+ pages....snip page 39

I...I was only joking but we are well on our way o_o

[Alistaire]

Seems half it is like that. Just find it interesting that people are arguing opinions for over 50 pages xD

There's only so far people can call things "opinions".

Facts:

This is a multiplayer game. You pay your sub but that doesn't entitle you to make other paying customers carry you. Do you go to McDonalds and snag fries off the strangers ahead of you? And then expect them to be ok with that because it's not a big deal?

This game is not rocket science. Sure there are more complex ways of optimization past the basics; nobody's expecting df people to be perfect. But it's grade 1 math to know what actions are the most efficient for 1, 3, or 6+ mobs, and the main complaint is against people not even trying to be good.

Duty finder is going to pair you up with people who want to do things at least relatively efficiently, and is a poor place to practice your latest oddball RP idea.

There's only so much politeness that can and even should be expected when you're failing this grade 1 math type of decision-making, making everyone else's job quantifiably harder and longer.

[Whiteroom]

I...I was only joking but we are well on our way o_o

The last one made 100, the page count goals in here are lower than duty finder dps expectations.

[Granyala]

Now, having Enochian's effect boosts all your damage, so it's nice to have up by default, but the level 60 'rotation' is situational, and not something you would use all the time. Certainly not for most trash pulls, since you'd only get a few spells off before you move onto the next group.

I agree that Enochian is "hit and miss" on dungeon trash. Too much downtime and running between fast dying mobs involved to maintain it.

[TheUltimateSeph]

No. Just ... NO.
This is a false statement and I have -0- sympathy for it.

Role play is one thing, crippling your output and making everyone suffer for it is another. Also, if you truly want to hardcore RP in a dungeon, get a custom group with likeminded people (good luck with that one).

People are expected to hold to a minimum standard rotation in group content in order to achieve acceptable output. No on is asking for extreme minmax or elite skills in random content, but purposefully gimping yourself is unacceptable.

Aside from the guy saying not to take it as encouragement it actually it possible for an Ice Mage to pull off some decent dps.

[Andrea]

I seriously doubt

1. No one should be joining a duty finder group to RP. At all. Whats to stop me joining a DF group and roleplaying that my fairy got sick so she isn't with me today? or roleplaying a whm that doesn't heal DPS? The answer should be common sense.
2. Why should I be the one that should make a premade group instead of using the duty finder? So its ok to roleplay in your opinion but its not ok to ask for an ounce of respect towards other party members and try to do your rotation at all.
3. Of course its about speed now its the same 2 dungeons for almost 4 months. I've seen everything they have to give me. If a tank wants to go slow thats fine, if they want to go fast also fine but that isn't an excuse for the design team not putting effort into making a dungeon look good. They did their job and did it well i might add with the new dungeons. I don't get why you would feel the need to say they should make our graphics old. I didn't know I had to look at every small little detail to warrant good visual design.
4. 5%>0%. Anyone can see that popping it adds more damage. As a DPS your job is to do as much damage as you possibly can. If you decide you don't want to do that you aren't doing the role you signed up for and are indeed being lazy.
5. You are correct, I don't have a license to tell people how to play. If I don't like that a DPS is clearly not trying then I will inform them to at least try to do something and then kick them if they still refuse to contribute. Im not looking for savage numbers here Im just looking for effort and if anyone responded to me like the Tank in OPs screenshot responded to him they would have been kicked asap. He literally says that as long as they don't wipe a few times they are ok. Forgive me for my thinking but the last time I checked those other people in the dungeon were actual people. What gives me the right to slow down whatever they are doing by simply refusing to use the skills the game gave me?

I literally cannot believe someone would say that people should be able to RP as ice mages in DF if they want to. Not only is it dumb to do in DF but its also rude as hell. I seriously hope I am misunderstanding something here.

[TheUltimateSeph]

1. No one should be joining a duty finder group to RP. At all. Whats to stop me joining a DF group and roleplaying that my fairy got sick so she isn't with me today? or roleplaying a whm that doesn't heal DPS? The answer should be common sense.
2. Why should I be the one that should make a premade group instead of using the duty finder? So its ok to roleplay in your opinion but its not ok to ask for an ounce of respect towards other party members and try to do your rotation at all.
3. Of course its about speed now its the same 2 dungeons for almost 4 months. I've seen everything they have to give me. If a tank wants to go slow thats fine, if they want to go fast also fine but that isn't an excuse for the design team not putting effort into making a dungeon look good. They did their job and did it well i might add with the new dungeons. I don't get why you would feel the need to say they should make our graphics old. I didn't know I had to look at every small little detail to warrant good visual design.
4. 5%>0%. Anyone can see that popping it adds more damage. As a DPS your job is to do as much damage as you possibly can. If you decide you don't want to do that you aren't doing the role you signed up for and are indeed being lazy.
5. You are correct, I don't have a license to tell people how to play. If I don't like that a DPS is clearly not trying then I will inform them to at least try to do something and then kick them if they still refuse to contribute. Im not looking for savage numbers here Im just looking for effort and if anyone responded to me like the Tank in OPs screenshot responded to him they would have been kicked asap. He literally says that as long as they don't wipe a few times they are ok. Forgive me for my thinking but the last time I checked those other people in the dungeon were actual people. What gives me the right to slow down whatever they are doing by simply refusing to use the skills the game gave me?

I literally cannot believe someone would say that people should be able to RP as ice mages in DF if they want to. Not only is it dumb to do in DF but its also rude as hell. I seriously hope I am misunderstanding something here.

The OP started the situation off wrong by making an inflammatory statement. The tank shouldn't have responded like they did but they were more in the right then the OP in my book. And other then not using one skill there was zero indication the BLM was doing a bad job otherwise. It was all a rant about Enochian and so called low standards. The OP deserved the kick they got. What gives you the right is it's your class, your character. Even if it's one skill, an extra 5% dps, people seem to explode over it like finishing the run a whole 2 minutes slower is going to kill them. You should be the one to make a premade group instead of using the Duty Finder because it has been established there is always going to be a time you will encounter this kind of thing in the Duty Finder, because it's random people. Yet people, knowing there is an alternative, continue to place themselves in that situation anyway and then proceed to rant about it and how horrible and rude people are. I have zero sympathy for people who knowingly take a chance at being put in this situation when they can avoid it altogether.