More Horizontal Progression please

[Xatsh]

No idea. In that case it was more a "Luxas barked, we jumped" thing due to licensing, but point stands. Drastically changed gameplay model and *destroyed* the game.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

It is broke is the problem.

Does it need to switch to ffxi-2 probably not (although I would like it, I know it will not work with the 95% casual base that makes up mmos now days), but the current model is not enough. That is the point of this post need more variety and more options endgame that are worth doing. (Worth it as in time = time for equivalent rewards).

[Sho86]

I'm sure its already been said but its got my vote. Wouldn't mind being able to gear out multiple jobs like in XI, and no the varied iLvl catch-up game we have here is nothing of the same; plus my gear to have meaning (I still remember how awesome it felt to complete my Gallant set in XI.) A lot of XI was indeed a pain in the rear but it actually felt like an accomplishment when you got it done, as compared to here your just rushing to keep up cause in a couple months its all worthless on top of being further behind in story.

[Hix]

If the rewards of new content aren't better than what you already have, then in what way are they worth getting?

[Nadirah]

I think too many of you want XI-II.

This is not and hopefully never will be XI-II.

[Sho86]

If the rewards of new content aren't better than what you already have, then in what way are they worth getting?

Assuming we're talking about the 'harder' fights, typically beyond the end game glamour would be to optimize stats. There has been plenty of threads about how tanks use certain pieces they feel fit their build, same can be done with any job. Different sets all with different stat focuses give the ability to mix/match. This gives the extreme elitists/raid pushers the ability to pursue to be top % in damage, while others can hang on to what they want to for longer and not feel pressured to constantly grind for gear. This would also keep the gap smaller, instead of getting into those mismatched parties with a iL170 tank and iL200 dps. They could even throw back in the +abilities; where the raiders will of course math out the best set, others can have their fun dabbling in whatever, as the difference would not be detrimental enough for normal content (non-savage etc).

I think too many of you want XI-II.

This is not and hopefully never will be XI-II.

Even with my previous post on this page, I do not want a XI-II. It didn't gain popularity for a reason. However, pushing too far to the other end of the spectrum is just as bad. I'm not asking for the return of Level caps/breaks, or impossible to solo scenarios for leveling, or 30+man "Eco-Warrior" content that requires 30+ to not push the damned-able button too early. I just want my gear to stay valid and worthwhile for more than a month or two (considering we don't acquire the jist of it till the next patch is ready to hit). I'd like to be able to gear up my DRG, be satisfied with where it sits, and have time to gear up a few other jobs to equal ability, not sub-par.



All in all, XI or not, most games allow a good deal longer on your gear to last you awhile. WoW's impact on gear was noticeable, yet minimal as I could pick back up on it after months break. Same with GW2, left it for nearly a year or so, came back and my characters still was able to do current content (including all the content i missed). This is multiple characters mind you, so different jobs and different views of the game at the same ability. If you did that in XIV currently, all of your characters would be vastly behind and you'd be scrambling to just get one character/one job to be barely on par, not to mention any side-content be damned.

[Velhart]

For people wanting FFXI like content and concepts in FFXIV.

If you really want things from FFXI in the game, I would suggest instead of asking SE to tear down something they have established already, to bring in an idea and then see how it can be worked into the context of FFXIV. Most ideas from XI I see revolve around SE tearing down the wall and rebuilding it. Instead, you should find a way to make it work into the system that is already placed.

Like this for example:
Open World Boss Fights: A classic one people request. An 8-man boss to fight open world. If this is something demanded, then you can make it part of the treasure maps. Gather the map, use it, and have a small chance of getting a rare map that spawns an S-Rank like boss. Kill it and receive rare items and say 100 of the latest currency (Esoteric) to influence others to join.

What people don't realize is that FFXI does fall under archaic design. It isn't to say what they brought to the table is bad or cannot be used in FFXIV, but you have to make it so it is set up to meet modern standards and work in the context of an already established formula game. If it doesn't, then you should realize it would be content that is broken or dead right out of the door.

[Kaurie]

I was going to add this yesterday, but I hit my post cap for the day apparently.

Here are ideas of adding horizontal progression without making 1 set that is 'optimal' or required:
1. Don't make the added fun stats effect damage/mitigation or healing abilities i.e.
a) Increased movement speed (not usable in PvP)
b) Summons a clone, this can either do damage and reduce your damage (for same output), take damage but reduce your health (for same total), or just be cosmetic
c) Frost shield, doesn't do damage or reduce damage, but will apply heavy to attackers
d) Translations/Lore based, equipping item translates some Eorzean text in-game to your native language for added lore
e) High jump, lets you jump higher
f) Increased durability, need to repair less often
etc..

2. Don't add armory chest bloat and multiple sets, but simply have an attunement/infusement/enchantment type process

[Iagainsti]

Errm... plenty? The CoP ring reward was still one of the best in the game, even after ToAU and WotG were released.

People who claim FFXI's horizontal progression failed obviously have no true recollection of actually playing the game. There were dozens of examples of great items which stood the test of time, and plenty more which people kept for macros to swap items in and out. Granted, we can't do the latter here in Heavensward, but I think there's still a lot of room to work with some decent optional sidegrades which aren't mind-crushingly dull or simple secondary-stat swaps.

Leaping Lizard Boots- on my Nin & Thf from lvl 7-75; still used in macros fro WS from 75-99.

[Iagainsti]

Honestly, If they would just make Void Ark 4 Islands, each with trash and one boss. If you join the DF for the 24 man, you do all the bosses linearly. You also have the option to do each island as a 8 man preformed full party with your FC ship; 1 boss plus the trash.

Here's the kicker;

Each island(8man only) has a door unlocked by an item that opens to another boss that's Savage like difficulty level. The items drop from zone events(ex island 1 door is opened by a item that drops like atma did, but only from fates in Sea of Clouds, 1 per character per week; another door is opened from an item is gotten from special maps, etc.) the bosses drop from the same loot table as the regular bosses, plus upgrade items(like gobtwine etc)

Point is, with your fc, you can run 8 bosses a week, do some open world events, it'd make use of all that open space plus give it a more FFXI feel for those in need.

[karateorangutang]

Eh depends how you mean. In raid content surely. Though my point would be why does it matter if the top raiders are in ilvl 150 gear and you are still in ilvl 90 gear if you are progressing and the gear is sufficient to do anything besides the raids past the ones immediately ahead of you.

That being said it was common practice among the top guilds (usually the #1 on each server) to host open raids. We would get our content on farm quickly and be down to like 2 raid nights a week. So we would take a random day (my guild did saturday) and host an open raid for the server. We would usually play alts (or play mains to help but "roll" for our alts) and take anyone who wanted to come through the easier raids of the current expansion.

Commends to your guild for doing that, but my experience in other games hasn't been like that. Most of the time there is a high bar to entry into high end content and that leads to a sort of "click" of people that run that content. It was really bad in FFXI. Alot of content was gated by large groups of not only capped characters, but geared to be able to do it as well. In XI you didn't just waltz into dynamis or limbus. You had to spend alot of time acquiring items and abilities to even be considered for something like that.

I think that is the fear of what they don't want.

For example:

I played FFXI for a year and really took my time ( I was working and in college at the time) leveling my paladin up. I loved tanking in FFXI and was super excited the day I hit level 75. So, I go around and try to get a LS that would take me on to get into sky and dynamis. Those slots were already filled by tanks that were already geared to the teeth. Noone wanted the new PLD and getting merits was a freakin' nightmare. So, I dropped PLD and leveled SAM to 75 instead. Same thing, go get a Hagun and Sniper rings and we'll talk kid. So I farm up the several million gil I need to buy these things and FINALLY i get to enter endgame content. It was 2 YEARS in the making.

Thats what SE did to the casual playerbase in XI. They are vehemently avoiding doing that again with this game.