The broken FFXIV Holy trinity

[Wobi]

first he's says cos they couldn't keep hate. Now it's cos the tank is dead. lol This stuff is comedy gold

So as someone who played FFXI I'm sure you are quite familiar that DPS could off-tank all the time and did so as the situation demanded, why would they add defensive cooldowns to DPS jobs if not to allow us to potentially stay in the fight until the tank could be raised and back up to fighting speed. Apparently the concept of skilled dynamic play is beyond your grasp, there is no need to stay to such a hard line of the "Holy Trinity" that people cannot help out in roles other than their primary one to salvage a fight gone wrong.

[Caraway]

Reading through this thread I don't think the OP understands the fundamental nature of this game: gross vertical progression.

Please note that people doing speed runs on the current 'hardest' dungeons (those in Expert Roulette) are doing them often in i110 or higher gear. These are dungeons that are tuned for i90 gear. They are completable in the game's original set of 'best' gear (first coil and capped tomestones). Think about that a moment.

You see people doing these huge pulls because the tanks have multiple thousands of HP more than the dungeon was tuned for, because healers have significantly higher output, as do the DPS. Try to do a big pull with content appropriate gear and then you can complain about broken trinities.

[Callinon]

Snip

That's exactly right, and that is what SHOULD happen when you outgear something to that degree. Higher level gear should make you MORE POWERFUL and allow you to do things you wouldn't have been able to do in lesser gear.

[Viridiana]

i stopped reading when you said this.

This is my point exactly. What a broken game when the Dps can tank a Huge boss like Titan .

Seriously, it's called overgearing. Try doing that in a mix of AF1, Darklight, and maybe a piece of AF2, with Garuda weapon tops. Try doing anything you're talking about at the gear level the content is actually designed for, not the level that was available when it came out. Hint: it's not going to work.

[Natsuno]

(I know cos i played FFXI and understand the FF holy trinity very well)

You mean the FFXI holy trinity, where people took dps classes and then used them as tanks, or took a dps class and used it for support/healing for the majority of the fight?

The current status quo in FFXIV is fine because this is how the game works at this stage in its expansion cycle (I know cos i played WoW and understand the holy trinity very well).

There is a lot of each of your classes that players aren't exploring cos they don't have to simply cos you made your mobs way too easy.

Not the case as a summoner, and has already been pointed out, tanks still have to manage their CDs.

[RiceisNice]

Seriously, it's called overgearing. Try doing that in a mix of AF1, Darklight, and maybe a piece of AF2, with Garuda weapon tops. Try doing anything you're talking about at the gear level the content is actually designed for, not the level that was available when it came out. Hint: it's not going to work.

He already replied that fights can be done/tuned so that even if you were to overgear it, it'd still hit hard. I mean at that point ,what else can you say? If it was tuned so that it can wreck people even if they overgeared it signifcantly (ilvl 120+ in ilvl 55 fights), then you wouldn't even be able to do it at the ilvl it was supposed to be for.

[Viridiana]

He already replied that fights can be done/tuned so that even if you were to overgear it, it'd still hit hard. I mean at that point ,what else can you say? If it was tuned so that it can wreck people even if they overgeared it signifcantly (ilvl 120+ in ilvl 55 fights), then you wouldn't even be able to do it at the ilvl it was supposed to be for.

True. I mean, he also seems to think that 40 ilvl isn't a big difference (SVHM requires i70, caps to i110). So, I really don't know what to say at this point. He's just that bad, I guess.

[Allyrion]

He already replied that fights can be done/tuned so that even if you were to overgear it, it'd still hit hard. I mean at that point ,what else can you say? If it was tuned so that it can wreck people even if they overgeared it signifcantly (ilvl 120+ in ilvl 55 fights), then you wouldn't even be able to do it at the ilvl it was supposed to be for.

Well, they could be stricter about the ilvl sync.
I mean, I don't care either way but that is the in-game way to stop/reduce overgearing making things trivial.
As it stands though, it's pretty lenient.

The other side is that people like seeing the effects of their new gear, and smashing up dungeons is one of the places you see that too.
I was in the crowd that didn't even think they'd add ilvl sync for that reason.

That said, I don't think it'd be unreasonable if they tightened a sync a little.

[Caraway]

Well, they could be stricter about the ilvl sync.
I mean, I don't care either way but that is the in-game way to stop/reduce overgearing making things trivial.
As it stands though, it's pretty lenient.

The other side is that people like seeing the effects of their new gear, and smashing up dungeons is one of the places you see that too.
I was in the crowd that didn't even think they'd add ilvl sync for that reason.

That said, I don't think it'd be unreasonable if they tightened a sync a little.

I believe there was mention of a new feature that'd let you sync to the minimum coming with Heavensward so that could be pretty fun.

[RiceisNice]

..

You don't want to go too overboard with item level sync if you're driving players to do old content for something like relic (or just old content in general). It just ends up being incredibly tedious. What I would wish they'd do is tune the "expert" dungeons a little bit higher. When they came up with our current expert (kotl, WPH and AKH), it was was tuned for ilvl90 at the point of game where we can get ilvl 120 from tomestones. There was already a discrepancy of 30 ilvls as soon as it was released.