Entitled DPS, please stop being entitled

[Seiryuukishi]

SNIP

If that's all you got out of that I do not know what to tell you. The entirety of that post was to get you to understand that no matter who instigated it you BOTH, B O T H, screwed up. And for what? Pride? No one is perfect and never will be, but two wrongs don't make a right. Sure you acknowledge you could have done better thus admitting you did wrong. I AM NOT trying to guilt trip you nor am I trying to make you out to be a sadistic monster whose only goal in life is to log onto a GAME and make others' lives miserable. I am trying to get you to understand what you did wrong so that in the future if it an occurrence like this happened again you could think back and go "Hmm, I'll do it this way so I don't have to deal with the headache of arguing". It is not about WHO is wrong, you both were. It's about WHAT went wrong and what future steps can be taken to prevent things like it from happening again. You think I enjoy doing this? I'd rather not have to but if by the end of it all you walk away with some understanding of how to defuse similar situations without having to resort to quiting tanking then so be it. I'm not going to lie and say that I haven't been harsh. That's my nature. If it gets the point across I'll be rougher than granite.

But never mistake my harshness for apathy or worse, hatred. I hate no one. I do hate it when people can't use sense. Admittedly there are times when you just won't get people to be peaceful, timid, or inclined to work with you no matter the disagreement. That's why you have the option to leave the instance or vote kick the person/s. And I do not assume, I take notice of what people act like and base my dealings with them on that. You don't strike me as a "bad" person but you do need to learn to simmer down. Some people are high strung and they are not always going to be pleasant when they word things. It doesn't mean they have a grudge against you. Generally they are less inclined to want to start an argument with you. Ultimately this is a GAME, but as you have interactions with living, breathing human beings just as with real life everyday stuff so as on here you won't get along with every Tom, Dick, and Harry you happen along in DF or otherwise. It's a crap shoot and when emotions are running high cooler heads prevail. It's hard for two or more people to come to an agreement when they're pissed at each other, no?

When it's all said and done it's your choice whether to keep tanking or not or for that matter doing anything in DF. But no matter what you play on here you won't escape stupidity. Either someone will come along with the intention to act like an idiot or something, somewhere will cause another fiasco. Someone has to be the peacemaker and the sooner it happens the better in those ordeals.

[nuyu11]

How long this thread gonna go?

In this game 1 character can play all class, so there is no specific group which one you're belong to.
You can be anything you want, yet people still want to make the comparison.
The person you saw playing DPS might be far more better TANK than you are.

And btw why so concern about that? You only met him for that run only then gone...
Your stress only for that run and less than 30 mins, not worth at all to keep whining about that.

[Krylo]

It is not about WHO is wrong, you both were.

With all due respect, that's bullshit.

There's no optional pulls in Dzaemel before the first boss that don't require standing on magitek pads (and, if memory serves, only one group is locked behind those). The first of which is just outside the first crystal area she (said she) pulled to.

There's no reason to assume the tank wasn't doing a full clear--as nothing had been, at that point, skipped. Indeed, the only other skippable pull in that dungeon is at the first exploding crystals, heading down for the optional chest.

A DPS then pulling a bunch of shit that was going to need to be fought eventually, anyway, and then refusing to AoE it, making the whole fight harder on everyone's TP/MP, with no consideration for anyone but himself is 100% in the wrong.

We can sit around all day going on about 'Maybe if you had been polite SOONER' if we want, but that's stupid and a hilarious double standard. Tank has to immediately respond with politeness and roses, but DPS can word anything anyway they like and are to be assumed to be in the best of intentions.

Do you even believe the things you're typing?

[Adire]

snip

The only "wrong" I did was that I didn't immediately respond to him, and that was partly due to failing to know what to say immediately, and partly due to refusing to be taken advantage of when being (what I perceived, whether right or wrong) demanded of. It was not my "ego" blocking me. I did not sit there and think, "welp, not going to help this guy now". It did not stem from any ego (unless being irked by someone making demands) problems, and I even "redeemed" myself by helping him kill the mobs he pulled while we discussed the compromise. He believed he had the right to get his way 100% and hold us hostage by using the healer, whose job is not to pull, as leverage to get his way 100%. He wanted the healer to not do their job in order to force us to abandon our rights completely.

My compromise and willingness to continue if he had indicated he was going to be a decent person was evidence of my coolheadedness as well. I will say I need to "simmer down" some after this thread though. 30 pages of people regularly throwing insults at me personally can become hurtful though, even though you haven't done it yourself. I'm not even arguing with you that I would have done things a little differently if I could go back in time (such as asking him to rephrase his first sentence), but hindsight is a benefit I did not have at the time. You also haven't thrown direct, personal insults at me and my character either, and I do thank you for that.

You're getting the wrong idea that I am egotistical enough to be uncompromising and unwilling to admit faults though. In this situation, I did nothing more than simply defend my rights. I took his into consideration even after he treated me terribly. And as I've said, I always do clears if asked nicely or if outvoted. An egotistical person would not do either of things.

And like I said, I've had far fewer bad experiences as a dps and healer. I main NIN and play BLM more than PLD these days too, and yet still have more bad experiences as a PLD.

snip

It's logical to make the comparison. Why? Because people still have preferred classes, and therefore preferred roles. That's why people say they main things. I main NIN for example, which is of course DPS.

He also may have been a better tank, I don't know. How is this relevant to anything though?

We can sit around all day going on about 'Maybe if you had been polite SOONER' if we want, but that's stupid and a hilarious double standard. Tank has to immediately respond with politeness and roses, but DPS can word anything anyway they like and are to be assumed to be in the best of intentions.

Very good points in your post Krylo, especially this one. Thank you

Everyone wanting me to assume the DPS had good intentions with his sentence and being okay with him assuming (and assuming themselves, judging by some posts here) that I had bad intentions by not immediately doing what he wanted or saying "please reword that" seems...odd.

[GenJoe]

snip

man you're such a kuso oyaji just like your character picture I love it!

Nobody's asking you to be a judge, take your mallet and go elsewhere.

Sitting on your high horse acting like you're some paragon of justice and neutrality, i.e. cowering behind your facade of mighty neutralness without voicing an actual opinion on the matter won't get you anybody's respect behind a keyboard..

It's all good on paper I suppose, but if you ask me, that's just a way to avoid taking a stance. If you don't have a stance, we don't need you to stand over our heads spewing from your high horse sir.


Now, back on your topic at hand.

Were both parties at fault? Sure. You're not the the first person to mention that btw, you seem to be under the impression that you are but there have been many people that's said that before you.. In either case, so what's your point beyond that?? Is that it?

[Vydos]

Long topic is long and I've only just read it now.

I'll just leave the next few words about my own thoughts of this.

Firstly,
Why even create such a thread? You had a bad experience with a dps in a run. Then what's the big deal? Everyone had bad experiences with someone, something in this game. And most likely on many occasions. As a fellow tank, I can attest to that. But that does not mean it happens all the time. This situation has nothing to do with dps being entitled. It's just someone being a bit of a jerk. And as far I know, this world has them. And you simply learn to deal with them or ignore them. And if you need to vent, do the same as me and vent it ingame with ls members.


Secondly,
I feel you both were in the wrong. But I have to admit that the DPS was definately an oddball. "I only have one AoE" Yeah...then why didn't he use it. That's what its for after all lol.
But you as tank are also partly to blame for feeling the entitlement that you control the entire run. Yes, we lead the run. But a leader is nothing without followers. And vice versa. But again, from what I read. It does really seem that the DPS was more in the wrong. Considering you tried to compromise, by pulling large mobs and AoE'ing them down. On the other hand, this might have been the highest leveled job the dps had. And he might not be familiar with speedruns/group pulls. Hence, why he might have thought that one AoE didn't cut it.

Remember, speed runs and large pulls only started with the higher ilvl instances. Players who just started to play won't really be familiar with those things at that level.

Just some food for thought.

[nuyu11]

100% agree

Such a wise words from Elven, are you Urianger long relative?
Just chill and don't whine OP.

[Adire]

snip

Yeah, he was an oddball. He has multiple classes at 50, including bard now. He's also a 50 WAR, a 50 WHM, and a 50 NIN, as well as has all 3* crafts. So if he hasn't figured out by now that AoEing sometimes is a good idea...then yeah...

Please note, I have said throughout the thread that if most of the group wants exp, I do exp. I've said if asked nicely, I give them exp. So I'm not entitled. It's only in the event of a tie that I think tanks should have the final say so, because it's their job to pull after all. This situation was a tie, and I was not asked nicely or treated fairly. I offered compromise rather than behave as a dictator, and tanked the mobs he pulled out of goodwill rather than let him tank them. Only reading my OP can be misleading.

This thread was to share my story with others, and to remind people to treat others like human beings and leave the pulling to the tanks. As someone who has witnessed and experienced the bias against tanks that many players seem to have, that is why I'm posting as well. I do not experience these things as a healer or DPS nearly as often, and I even play DPS far more often than I play PLD.

Such a wise words from Elven, are you Urianger long relative?
Just chill and don't whine OP.

I'll whine if I gosh darn feel like it, I pay my fee like everyone else :P

[Vydos]

*snip*

If he did have multiple jobs at lvl 50. Then he definately was a jerk. But perhaps he had some bad experiences himself or a bad day.
And apologies, if I offended you. It's just how it came across from the first post. And I've only read the first 10 pages.

And you are entitled to complain. I just feel that this might be a bit overdramatic than it should be. It still, after all, remains an average day in the DF. Which most of the time goes well but can as easily go sour.

Such a wise words from Elven, are you Urianger long relative?

Haha, I'm flattered. But I'm Urianger more hotter and sexier version. *strikes a pose*

[AriaEnia]

No proof of whether the dps or the tank who was entitled. Shouldve been including the screenshot of the chat.
I mean, not fair only listening to only 1 side of the story dont you think?

Oh btw, I play tank myself and i never thought i am the leader, being a rebel and whatnot :/