fflogs and privacy

[Dzian]

In order for fflogs to efficiently work as intended, sadly it cannot be an opt in thing. They need to scan every single person in the party of the person who is uploading that log because they need to verify that they all played legitimately. They have a system to detect if anyone used certain cheats to gain damage advantages and if a single person in that party did, everyone benefited from that so they will invalidate the entire log. They need to know how much RDPS ppl gained from others from their raid buffs etc. There is no way they just can't scan everyone in the party's numbers. There's a reason they do things the way they do and it isn't to harm anyone. Don't blame the website. It's simply supposed to be a tool for ppl who want to improve and push themselves further, blame the brainrotted ppl who use the tool for their clownery. Also, removing fflogs would kill the raid scene, and SE is well aware of this fact so it's not going anywhere. It's been here since the beginning and it will be til the day the game shuts down.

Not at all. All it needs is to anonymize the data. Oh look this parse contains data regarding Blackmage Bob. He did 10k dps in encounter x. But isn't registered on fflogs and hasn't opted in. So now it says "Unregistered Blackmage" did 10k. The data collected is the exact same all that's changed is player names are hidden. Doesn't impact data integrity at all.

[Alice_Rivers]

I really don't see a problem here, kicking or sidelining or harassing people using logs is against TOS and therefore reportable, and there's a method (which admittedly could be better displayed) to hide your logs if you're really that worried about them.

[Lilapop]

Not at all. All it needs is to anonymize the data. Oh look this parse contains data regarding Blackmage Bob. He did 10k dps in encounter x. But isn't registered on fflogs and hasn't opted in. So now it says "Unregistered Blackmage" did 25k. The data collected is the exact same all that's changed is player names are hidden. Doesn't impact data integrity at all.

But then how would anyone harass anyone? Think, Dzian!!!

[BigCheez]

Not at all. All it needs is to anonymize the data. Oh look this parse contains data regarding Blackmage Bob. He did 10k dps in encounter x. But isn't registered on fflogs and hasn't opted in. So now it says "Unregistered Blackmage" did 25k. The data collected is the exact same all that's changed is player names are hidden. Doesn't impact data integrity at all.

It would make tomestone pretty useless and enable prog lying, for one.

[BokoToloko]

I really don't see a problem here, kicking or sidelining or harassing people using logs is against TOS and therefore reportable, and there's a method (which admittedly could be better displayed) to hide your logs if you're really that worried about them.

Problem is, not everyone knows about fflogs, the site also shows logs on casual fights (normal raids and ARs) meaning there can be logs of a character that hasn't ever touched anything beyond EX trials and this solution places the burden of responsibility on users, who aren't really at fault. Also, ayone who looks to harrass people thrugh the logs will move to take the hidden logs as an admission of guilt of sorts as a hidden logs makes it obvious that the person knows about the page and has gone out of their way to hid the data. And it sounds like splitting hairs but, sadly, that's about how persistent people can get. This kind of mindset has even surfaced on the TalesFromDF subreddit.

They could, at the very least, set character logs to be hidden by default, instead of the other way around. The best way to deal with a problem is to prevent it from happening to begin with, rather than deal with it when it comes to the door.

[TaleraRistain]

This sounds very sus on so many levels. What content are they progging? Because in savage and above doing a kitchen sink to stay alive because the healer is greeding DPS always leads to poor outcomes.

Tank mitigations are very specific and spaced out in a very precise manner. Only maybe as OT, you can afford a few liberties, otherwise not really. If they need to do a kitchen sink and they are MT, on the next TB they will just flat out die.

Also if the tanks die, there is a high chance the rest of the party dies as well. Even normal attacks from bosses are no joke.

This reminds me of a funny story when a DPS friend greeded an opener and Hephastois deleted him in 1 and a half attacks. He just melted. We couldn't stop laughing for 5 minutes straight.

Savage and up in her case. I haven't stepped into Ultimates so just Savage in mine. We're both the main tanks of our statics.

It's not really sus. My healers this tier in this static are great but the healers we had last tier who decided not to come back this tier (a husband and wife team and my friend also has a husband and wife team currently) cared more about their parse than keeping us alive. I remember we were progging P11S and still learning and getting clipped by things and instead of thinking of what they could do to help us see more of the fight by maybe pushing a little more healing, they blamed the rest of us for taking avoidable damage. You're right that the healer greeding dps does often lead to poor outcomes. My point was that my fantastic static healer and her healers get comparable numbers and would look the same if you just looked at their logs, but they are vastly different in how they support us and the value they provide to the party.

[BigCheez]

Savage and up in her case. I haven't stepped into Ultimates so just Savage in mine. We're both the main tanks of our statics.

It's not really sus. My healers this tier in this static are great but the healers we had last tier who decided not to come back this tier (a husband and wife team and my friend also has a husband and wife team currently) cared more about their parse than keeping us alive. I remember we were progging P11S and still learning and getting clipped by things and instead of thinking of what they could do to help us see more of the fight by maybe pushing a little more healing, they blamed the rest of us for taking avoidable damage. You're right that the healer greeding dps does often lead to poor outcomes. My point was that my fantastic static healer and her healers get comparable numbers and would look the same if you just looked at their logs, but they are vastly different in how they support us and the value they provide to the party.

What were you getting clipped by in P11S that didn't just kill you outright? Anabaseios was basically clipped = dead, dead = wipe. There honestly wasn't a great deal that healers could do beyond LB3 to save a pull. They just mit and heal the raid damage and if people fail mechanics then you're cooked. That raid tier was notorious for RDMs not even being able to do much to help salvage pulls.

[TaleraRistain]

What were you getting clipped by in P11S that didn't just kill you outright? Anabaseios was basically clipped = dead, dead = wipe. There honestly wasn't a great deal that healers could do beyond LB3 to save a pull. They just mit and heal the raid damage and if people fail mechanics then you're cooked. That raid tier was notorious for RDMs not even being able to do much to help salvage pulls.

I dunno, dude, I've slept since then. I'm also a tank. I can get clipped by something here and there and not die. Tank priv is a thing, even in Savage, unless it's something like P10S poison. But the idea remains that when you are progging, if you have anyone more concerned about their numbers on a website than doing what they can to help the party see the next mechanic, it's going to be detrimental to your progress.

[Lilapop]

It would make tomestone pretty useless and enable prog lying, for one.

Are you saying prog lying isn't a thing right now...?

[BigCheez]

I dunno, dude, I've slept since then. I'm also a tank. I can get clipped by something here and there and not die. Tank priv is a thing, even in Savage, unless it's something like P10S poison. But the idea remains that when you are progging, if you have anyone more concerned about their numbers on a website than doing what they can to help the party see the next mechanic, it's going to be detrimental to your progress.

You can but the rest of the party can't.

Ironically, you probably could have solved this problem via FFLogs by checking their logs to see if they were letting people die to damage when you were recruiting them.

Are you saying prog lying isn't a thing right now...?

No, I'm saying it would be worse if Tomestone was less reliable.