How would you solve the boring "damage rotation" of the healers?

[Renathras]

Understood. However, I think the disconnect is that when I check these forums I see more “Healers need more complex dps rotations” “Healers need more dps options” all I see is about dps. I’ve also seen some suggest more support/utility and they get scolded with “having more utility won’t fix the issues with healers” So basically since SB was loved so much then should every healer get 2 more dots to make them happy? Should they get more traits to lower the cooldown of specific abilities like sch’s quickened aetherflow?

It just seems no matter what people want rather is dps or utility they will always be told that they don’t understand healers and that’s not what will make healers better. So that’s where my confusion comes in. All I’m asking for is a thought out post on what exactly do they want to see on every healer. I think that helps more than just saying “ I want more dps options” “I want more utility”

That’s all I’m saying here.

Yes, it's very frustrating.

And as I pointed out above, it doesn't always even make sense - WHO actually wants WHM to have to cast Cure 1 and 2 to get Lilies? And for the Lilies to just lower the CD of the next Benison (30 seconds base, 28.8 [1.2 sec faster], 27 [3 sec faster], 24 [6 sec faster]), Assize (60 seconds base, 57.6 [2.4 sec faster], 54 [6 sec faster], 48 [12 sec faster]) [Recall that Assize's base CD at this time was 60 sec, meaning you have to now cast THREE Cure 1/2s to get Assize down to a 48 sec CD, which is 8 seconds LONGER than current EW Assize is], or Asylum (90 seconds base, 86.4 [3.6 sec faster], 81 [9 sec faster], 72 [18 sec faster]). Get three Lilies then have to cast a Benison? Congratulations, you just wasted an 18 sec faster Asylum or an Assize 8 seconds LONGER than current to save all of 6 seconds on Benison. Who wants that? Who wants to have to cast Medica/Medica 2/Cure 3 THREE TIMES to get a Plenary effect? Do those things really sound fun?

What about SB WHM do people want, aside from Dia to have an 18 sec duration and Aero 3 as an AOE DoT with a 24 sec rotation? Do people genuinely WANT something else from SB WHM? What?

Despite me reminding people frequently, I think folks somehow DON'T remember how absolutely stupid SB WHM was. "Twirly staff" blocks everything else out somehow.

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But yeah, people suggest other things and are told those things won't work. Then when anyone says that, they get told "no one ever said that" while...also saying that.

It is interesting that, when asked for a design proposal, it's often talking about the DPS with an occasional token "have Cure 1 upgrade into Cure 2" type of thing, but not really addressing the non-DPS side of the kit. There are exceptions (in the healer forum), but even they tend - TEND - to be more DPS focused.

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For what it's worth, I posted a threat to try to get people talking about the other parts of the SB kits, specific things people wanted from SB to combine with things from now: https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...ld-be-combined...

...so far, the only post was someone kinda heckling the post in a "why did you post this, we have plenty" kind of snarky reply completely missing the point.

Specifically, people all the time say they want SB kits, or parts of them, back. And I'm asking which parts. For WHM, since I'm told we CAN'T keep the EW WHM as it is, what from SB do people want back? Is it JUST 18 sec Dia and a 24 sec AOE Aero 3? Or do they want to have to cast Cure 1 to generate Lilies which cut Benison's CD by 6 seconds? Because those are pretty different things, and different than a new elemental gauge, new burst windows, or "WHM should be like BLM with big long cast time nukes", as SB WHM didn't have...well...any of those things.

Again showing you cant argue in good faith.

No, that's what you just did.

I actual make posts and arguments while you offer nothing but heckling and this weird fetish about insisting I'm posting in bad faith.

Either you can quantify your positions or you can't. If you can't, you can't use those for arguments. You can't say "people giving no effort shouldn't pull good DPS numbers" if you can't define the line between "no effort" and "effort".

I was fine if cleric stance remained on a single job,

God, Cleric Stance was SUCH an awful ability. The best way I've ever seen it described is "the worst case of rose tinted goggles in MMO history".

I agree having it on one Job could work, if the Job was actually designed around it, but it definitely shouldn't be a role-wide thing for healers.

Technically true, but that doesn't mean your personal DPS was the one deciding factor, or the most important deciding factor. Anyone else doing 10-20% less damage would have also led to a wipe.

True.

Including me.

Meaning if my damage was reduced by 10-20%, that would have been the difference. The point still stands, my friend.

I do agree it'd be great if every PF clear party had excellent DPS players that never died and pulled 99s...but I've yet to be in one that does.

Anytime a party hits enrage at a low percent, everyone is going to feel like there are dozens of things they could’ve done differently anyway, but it’s not one person’s fault. The truth is that the run just isn’t clean enough yet. Your group needs to get a better grip on mechanics.

That's great when you...have a Static or something.

Not so great when you're in PF hell with randoms trying to prog for a week and this party was the closest you got from the random Murphy lottery to an actual clear.

The problem is, that CBU3's idea of difficulty is artificial. It's one shot mechanics.

Yeah, this.

Let's just say I'm not a huge fan of EW encounter design. Savages have body checks. But even here, in EW, they seem to have more - or people are complaining more about them.

But the big issue to me is they've filtered down into Extremes. Some far less than others. Zodiark Ex only has arguably 2 and they're more soft body checks since you can sorta brute force them with enough mitigation (admittedly harder when it was current), Styx. On the other end, Golbez had by my count somewhere between 7 and 9, often several back to back. Zeromus and Barb and Hyd felt a lot more fair, with each having things that could be harder if you didn't have people (party stacks, for example), but which you could potentially get through as a party if you worked together.

This is correct. Body checks everywhere, if one person fails a mechanic making everyone die, I hate these so much along side most raid-wide damage is just "This does just so much damage" making them HP checks, and less about healing, imo. Its another problem that makes healing more about meeting HP checks than doing any consistent healing and because there is no need for constant healing, Healers tend to spend their time DPSing. Cause most times during a raid, you are either at full hp, nearly dead (from a raid wide), or dead.

Yeah, "mitigation checks". "This WILL 100% the party unless you use mitigation, then it will do 90% and the healers can heal people up. Oh, and we're giving most of the mitigation to DPS and Tanks. And for parties of WHM + AST, may god have mercy upon your poor non-barrier souls."

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Okay, this is long enough. Going to stop there, cut it in half, maybe thirds...

Hm. Still long, but perhaps better...