Let's redefine "damage taxes"

[Avoidy]

You really wanna compare how many times RDM have to be on melee range vs. how many times SMN have to be on melee range? RDM doesnt go melee range only to do its combo. We do have 2 charges of Corps-a-corps and Engagement/Displacement, its an oGCD melee range skill.

I mean, on that same token I could ask if you *really* want to compare verraise to having one solid res that burns your swiftcast and results in a gimped rotation for the entire fight.

But nah, I don't want to do that, because that wasn't my main point. My point's never even been about job difficulty, because I'll agree that SMN is streamlined as hell. But it should still do more damage than RDM, because without that damage difference, there's no viable reason for it to exist, and it's just a worse RDM in every conceivable way. This is my main point. I only nitpicked because I found it amusing to watch you talk about melee range and then immediately bring up ifrit.

At least SMN would still have a good toolkit, party buffs, personal mitigation, mobility and a back up res.

RDM would have a better party buff, better personal mitigation, and a better res. Nobody would be out here like "damn, SMN really lags behind on everything, but boy can it walk! Let's bring it anyway!" We literally saw this last tier before the devs gave it potency buffs, and SMN was dumpstered.

Other than flavor preference (or unable to handle a complicated Job), which is kind of the point...

When I said "bring along," I meant for parties to want them in their groups. No group is going to care about your personal flavor preference when they address viability. It's great if people still want to play the job even if it's broken in a bad way, but we've seen how pf just bans jobs from their groups. Btw, loving how when smn becomes not-viable, it's fine "because people will still play it for fun," but when rdm is on the bottom it's not fine and needs to be addressed immediately.

The way to resolve this is mini tiers based on all the factors of difficulty (which in actuality is the only true tax). Which be basically come out to be BLM > MNK/NIN/DRG/SAM > RPR/RDM > BRD/DNC > SMN/MCH. This is the only real solution for how the Jobs currently are

And I disagree with your proposed solution, for reasons others have already stated. Difficulty is subjective, the people who played these jobs never asked for them to be dumbed down, and RDM already has utility factors that would make people bring it along even if it had slightly lower damage than a SMN. In your tier list, SMN is completely dumpstered because now it's just a shitty damage dealer that provides less utility. And MCH is already a dumpster fire situation so I won't get into that.

I feel like I'm just going in circles at this point. I'll never see subjective difficulty as a solid measurement for how much damage a job should do. You've gotta address incomparables like party utility or you create situations where certain jobs get completely left behind.

[Arguscbf]

I mean, on that same token I could ask if you *really* want to compare verraise to having one solid res that burns your swiftcast and results in a gimped rotation for the entire fight.

But nah, I don't want to do that, because that wasn't my main point. My point's never even been about job difficulty, because I'll agree that SMN is streamlined as hell. But it should still do more damage than RDM, because without that damage difference, there's no viable reason for it to exist, and it's just a worse RDM in every conceivable way. This is my main point. I only nitpicked because I found it amusing to watch you talk about melee range and then immediately bring up ifrit.



RDM would have a better party buff, better personal mitigation, and a better res. Nobody would be out here like "damn, SMN really lags behind on everything, but boy can it walk! Let's bring it anyway!" We literally saw this last tier before the devs gave it potency buffs, and SMN was dumpstered.

If i have to pinpoint this kind of thing, about being on melee range, i have to be fair, right? But still, RDM suffers the most because of its long casting spells. SMN has Ifrit's dash but have TONS of insta casting spells.