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  1. #71
    Player
    Vanguard319's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    I've returned! First I find pants, then Louisoix dies for sending me to the void.
    Posts
    1,272
    Character
    Uni Neko
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    Archer Lv 72
    Quote Originally Posted by Buddhsie View Post
    For someone who's accomplished so little you sure have a funny view of things, Gath.

    For those of you who played FFXI; Remember the days when ZNM first came out, those NMs were all different, and required unique, interesting methods to kill which changed depending on the size of your party. All were low-mannable with good players, but could be tackled slightly more easily with a full alliance. This is the type of fights they need to be adding, not more of the stronghold NM-type fights (stand still and kill as fast as possible). Anyone who believes that the Moogle and Ifrit fights are less interesting than these is surely mistaken. Perhaps confused after doing them so many times over, and doing stronghold NMs far less often in comparison?

    The Moogle and Ifrit fights are really well done when you think about it, they require complete knowledge of positioning and surroundings, and constant adjustments and reactions to events. What more do you want? Feel free to offer suggestions rather than saying "Oh they suck". The Ifrit fight in particular was a lot more fun before certain positions that made moving around and dodging attacks less common. To suggest an Ifrit in which people would not be safe ANYWHERE would surely piss off a lot of people, as I'd say at least 75% of players wouldn't be able to beat it. But hey, we can easy-mode it for those that complain, right?

    I kinda went off on a rant there, following the comment concerning another of Gath's self-indulgent threads.. And before I forget about Darkhold, the aspect that made it interesting and unique was not only the fights that required some amount of strategy, but the openness of the reward system (i.e. being able to complete certain/all objectives for different chests containing different items).

    So let me speak for the majority of people who like a challenge, don't constantly QQ on threads, and don't want the small majority ruling over the future content; Please make more fights like Ifrit, Moogle and Darkhold.
    +1 this, poster has clearly done both fights, and can see thier merits. As for people complaining about the difficulty of the fights, it would certainly be amusing to see you do better, and I'm sure that someone will complain.
    (2)

  2. #72
    Player
    TheFatHousecat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    710
    Character
    Deepening Shadow
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Vanguard319 View Post
    you must define challenge as Absolute Virtue difficult, or perhaps Pandemonium warden before it's difficulty nerf.
    Bro I played XI but I never did any of those fights, so I'm not going to waste people's time by drawing connections to fights in games that I'm not completely familiar with.

    What I can tell you, with absolute certainty, is that the current NMs/dungeons/what have you in XIV are easy. And ideally, in a game with all sorts of content to suit all needs, there would be content that only the most skilled would be able to complete.
    (0)

  3. #73
    Player
    Buddhsie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    331
    Character
    Buddhsie Asura
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Lancer Lv 50
    FatHouseCat is right, as another person who is in a decent linkshell expecting a challenge, they can also see the necessity for difficult content.
    (0)

  4. #74
    Player
    Firon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Ul'dah
    Posts
    2,565
    Character
    Firon Veleth
    World
    Excalibur
    Main Class
    Thaumaturge Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by Buddhsie View Post
    For someone who's accomplished so little you sure have a funny view of things, Gath.

    For those of you who played FFXI; Remember the days when ZNM first came out, those NMs were all different, and required unique, interesting methods to kill which changed depending on the size of your party. All were low-mannable with good players, but could be tackled slightly more easily with a full alliance. This is the type of fights they need to be adding, not more of the stronghold NM-type fights (stand still and kill as fast as possible). Anyone who believes that the Moogle and Ifrit fights are less interesting than these is surely mistaken. Perhaps confused after doing them so many times over, and doing stronghold NMs far less often in comparison?

    The Moogle and Ifrit fights are really well done when you think about it, they require complete knowledge of positioning and surroundings, and constant adjustments and reactions to events. What more do you want? Feel free to offer suggestions rather than saying "Oh they suck". The Ifrit fight in particular was a lot more fun before certain positions that made moving around and dodging attacks less common. To suggest an Ifrit in which people would not be safe ANYWHERE would surely piss off a lot of people, as I'd say at least 75% of players wouldn't be able to beat it. But hey, we can easy-mode it for those that complain, right?

    I kinda went off on a rant there, following the comment concerning another of Gath's self-indulgent threads.. And before I forget about Darkhold, the aspect that made it interesting and unique was not only the fights that required some amount of strategy, but the openness of the reward system (i.e. being able to complete certain/all objectives for different chests containing different items).

    So let me speak for the majority of people who like a challenge, don't constantly QQ on threads, and don't want the small majority ruling over the future content; Please make more fights like Ifrit, Moogle and Darkhold.
    I agree as a Vet XI player Ifrit and Moogle is designed better than any boss XI ever had all of them was just tank and spank with no real strat. Throw DD's and cure's @ it.
    (3)

  5. #75
    Player
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    778
    Quote Originally Posted by Buddhsie View Post
    So let me speak for the majority of people who like a challenge, don't constantly QQ on threads, and don't want the small majority ruling over the future content; Please make more fights like Ifrit, Moogle and Darkhold.
    If people want difficulty they won't want something like Ifrit and Moogle, I do agree on Darkhold, though, it had a lot more potential, maybe the new dungeons will surpass that.

    Gath hates to bring it to you, but people dislike Ifrit and Moogle more than enjoy it. Though, the mechanics are a different thing, they are designed well for what we are working with on the server, the idea is awesome, it's just missing that pazazz

    Gath's 1 gil is worth more than your 1 gil.
    (1)
    Last edited by Gath; 03-03-2012 at 12:50 PM.

  6. #76
    Player
    Buddhsie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    331
    Character
    Buddhsie Asura
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Lancer Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by Gath View Post
    If people want difficulty they won't want something like Ifrit and Moogle, I do agree on Darkhold, though, it had a lot more potential, maybe the new dungeons will surpass that.

    Gath hates to bring it to you, but people dislike Ifrit and Moogle more than enjoy it. Though, the mechanics are a different thing, they are designed well for what we are working with on the server, the idea is awesome, it's just missing that pazazz

    Gath's 1 gil is worth more than your 1 gil.
    I know they dislike it.. But the reason is not because the fight is designed poorly or is too easy, it's mostly because we're forced to do it >100x to get all the rewards.
    (4)

  7. #77
    Player
    TheFatHousecat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    710
    Character
    Deepening Shadow
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Buddhsie View Post
    I know they dislike it.. But the reason is not because the fight is designed poorly or is too easy, it's mostly because we're forced to do it >100x to get all the rewards.
    I don't mind doing a fight >100 times to get certain rewards, that just makes those rewards mean more when you finally get them.

    I think the fights themselves are too easy, and that is why I dislike them. I might be a minority in that, but I know at least a handful of people who feel the same.
    (2)

  8. #78
    Player
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    778
    Quote Originally Posted by Buddhsie View Post
    I know they dislike it.. But the reason is not because the fight is designed poorly or is too easy, it's mostly because we're forced to do it >100x to get all the rewards.
    But have the items drop more often just shortens the life span of the content that a vast majority will be doing.

    Gath's 1 gil is worth more than your 1 gil.
    (2)

  9. #79
    Player
    Buddhsie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    331
    Character
    Buddhsie Asura
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Lancer Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by Gath View Post
    But have the items drop more often just shortens the life span of the content that a vast majority will be doing.
    Then what sort of solution to you recommend? How can you do the exact same thing over 100x and not find it boring? Eventually everything becomes a routine. I myself would agree with FatHouseCat in saying I'd rather do something 10x as difficult and only have to complete it 10x to get the rewards. The challenge would be in winning, not how many times you beat it.
    (0)

  10. #80
    Player
    Halvaard_Vidan's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    144
    Character
    Halvaard Vidan
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Conjurer Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by Lumidus View Post
    More raids are coming and I remember darkhold was fun and challenging. IMO it still is. It has puzzles and obstacles along with a mini boss and a real boss. The loot system in there was best too. These boss fights feel more like BCNM
    Are we thinking of the same Darkhold?

    Run past stuff,
    kill a fish for a chest,
    run past stuff,
    hit a few circle things,
    run past stuff,
    *everything blurs togeather untill Ogre*
    Kill miniboss while dodging ghosty death,
    R U N P A S T S T U F F,
    Hit the Garlean room if anyone needs it,
    run past stuff,
    *another blur*
    Kill Batral.

    On Ifrit: still haven't won, bad network latency prevents me from avoiding floor plumes 70% of the time unless I'm already running when they load under me.
    (2)
    Last edited by Halvaard_Vidan; 03-03-2012 at 06:14 PM.

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