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  1. #121
    Player
    ZedxKayn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    719
    Character
    Capybara Friend
    World
    Excalibur
    Main Class
    Blue Mage Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Ftail View Post
    Maybe the tank accidently dragged and dropped his AOE spell off his bar or switched his bar. Maybe dropping his stance was a misclick. The fact a GM has to search for an entire dungeons battle logs and deduce what happened is absolutely overwhelming. The reason why GM's don't tell people the results and that they are only looking into it is to make players feel satisfied it's getting GM attention. There's a reason vote kicking and leaving a dungeon is an option. GM's are not omnipotent and going to be able deduce small things like a tank purposely letting a DPS die from not hitting his AOE combo based off of combat logs. It's just not realistic, when they are probably understaffed and underpaid and need to get through tons of more reports so they are going to only look for obvious indicators.

    In a perfect world those tanks would be punished, I honestly wish they were, I just don't see how that's at all a realistic expectation.
    CTRL+F homie, CTRL+F. No one knows what kind of tools GMs have to but if malicious rescueing is reportable and taken seriously no reason they can't find something like the drop of a tank stance followed by a death across the whole dungeon or the ceasing of AOEs in a given time frame.

    Also tbh how would someone remove their AOE combo and not notice from the very beginning? If it's really a hotbar issue, that wouldn't prevent them from trying to grab aggro off people with ranged and voke.
    (2)
    im baby

  2. #122
    Player
    Mavrias's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    1,071
    Character
    Jyn Willowsong
    World
    Faerie
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso View Post
    Ill guess Ill just Echo it in an independent post...even though I know exactly how the internet works and it will likely be ignored, or people will just say Im making excuses and creating a scapegoat. So what, whatever, but Ill make it known.

    My attitude about this was way back in HW (Heavensward) Back when I was newer at the game. FFXIV is my 1st and only MMO, so many concepts are still to this day lost on me, because I simply dont know or understand them.
    Now, yes to any naysayers who will believe the opposite, I know what my role is as a tank. My issue is that I was trying to learn and get better at it at the time, but as Im learning, people would decide Im to slow and suck, so they would run ahead and just take my job from me, and harass me about it. (but hey, Im the toxic one right?) Being a novice, and with how gaining aggro was a little slower, I wasnt good. Many people sweat bullets over the responsibilities of the role, and as it happened a few times, yes I became petty and jaded about it. So I got that attitude...you want to tank -takes off stance- go for it.
    I became so done with fighting about it, and trying to explain I was new and learning. I met a good amount of Toxic people starting out.

    Now, fast foreword, I run into it nearly...never. Im a better tank now, aggro generation is childs play. And amusingly, outside of Alliance Raids, nobody runs ahead of the Tank anymore. At least not the groups Ive been in.

    So just to make it known to people coming at me, this attitude is from Years ago. None of this has happened in the past 4 years or so
    this reads like back peddling because people didn't agree with you, tbh.

    "this is an old attitude from years ago I've, I've grown past this!" doesn't really land well when you've spent several pages defending that attitude and using current and future language like "am," will," and "are."
    (12)

  3. #123
    Player
    HisShadowX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Ul'dah
    Posts
    332
    Character
    William Hart
    World
    Jenova
    Main Class
    Samurai Lv 90
    Three things that grind my gears are

    1) Healers who DPS rather then Heal or only heal when the tank has less then 15% health left which can be challenging if the pulls are big.

    2) DPS that pull instead of the tank.

    I have one exception if we are leveling or I am in a random leveling section if a DPS wants to drag some enemies towards me and once I AOE and capture the argo as a tank then the DPS moves behind the enemies I am good

    3) DPS back seat drivers. Ever drive and someone in the car who is in the passenger seat or back seat who critiques everything you do in terms of driving?

    Yeah that’s them. Often these people offer little to no constructive feed back. Are mass pullers that can cause dungeon wipes. They start drama.

    Very few I would say I have experienced are actual good mentors. I have met some great DPS who you can say are like backseat drivers except their feedback is informing and there are things I learned just from these people. Especially being on the PS4 some of these people have gave me tips on things I can do that I had no idea I could do.

    The difference between them and the DPS backseat drivers is one is helpful the other is more a critic to everything moving without feedback that helps the entire party.
    (1)

  4. #124
    Player
    HisShadowX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Ul'dah
    Posts
    332
    Character
    William Hart
    World
    Jenova
    Main Class
    Samurai Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Ftail View Post
    Maybe the tank accidently dragged and dropped his AOE spell off his bar or switched his bar. Maybe dropping his stance was a misclick. The fact a GM has to search for an entire dungeons battle logs and deduce what happened is absolutely overwhelming. The reason why GM's don't tell people the results and that they are only looking into it is to make players feel satisfied it's getting GM attention. There's a reason vote kicking and leaving a dungeon is an option. GM's are not omnipotent and going to be able deduce small things like a tank purposely letting a DPS die from not hitting his AOE combo based off of combat logs. It's just not realistic, when they are probably understaffed and underpaid and need to get through tons of more reports so they are going to only look for obvious indicators.

    In a perfect world those tanks would be punished, I honestly wish they were, I just don't see how that's at all a realistic expectation.
    Yeah I know this has happened to me. In my case I was on the PS4. I have skill quickbars for lvl 50,60,70, and 80 to just in case I need to switch on the fly I can do sometimes it’s easy to press the button and not know till you see the enemies attacking other members.

    Also after 8 or so dungeon runs sometimes you can be forgetful and press that key button for your stance. It happens and when it happens to me as a DPS and the other DPS start complaining I remind them he just forgot it’s going to be okay lol

    When you enter the dungeon in the game the game should automatically toggle the tank stance on and it should be made permanently on.

    That would solve a great many issues.
    (1)

  5. #125
    Player
    Anya_Synia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Posts
    117
    Character
    Anya Synia
    World
    Moogle
    Main Class
    Dancer Lv 90
    I never pull mobs except for those couple of times in MSQ roulette where I see how many cutscenes I can trigger before I die. Certainly makes it less mundane and more amusing when I die, even more amusing if my fc run with me and we all do it.
    (0)

  6. #126
    Player
    HisShadowX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Ul'dah
    Posts
    332
    Character
    William Hart
    World
    Jenova
    Main Class
    Samurai Lv 90
    Three things that grind my gears are

    1) Healers who DPS rather then Heal or only heal when the tank has less then 15% health left which can be challenging if the pulls are big.

    2) DPS that pull instead of the tank.

    I have one exception if we are leveling or I am in a random leveling section if a DPS wants to drag some enemies towards me and once I AOE and capture the argo as a tank then the DPS moves behind the enemies I am good

    3) DPS back seat drivers. Ever drive and someone in the car who is in the passenger seat or back seat who critiques everything you do in terms of driving?

    Yeah that’s them. Often these people offer little to no constructive feed back. Are mass pullers that can cause dungeon wipes. They start drama.

    Very few I would say I have experienced are actual good mentors. I have met some great DPS who you can say are like backseat drivers except their feedback is informing and there are things I learned just from these people. Especially being on the PS4 some of these people have gave me tips on things I can do that I had no idea I could do.

    The difference between them and the DPS backseat drivers is one is helpful the other is more a critic to everything moving without feedback that helps the entire party.
    (0)

  7. #127
    Player
    ZedxKayn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    719
    Character
    Capybara Friend
    World
    Excalibur
    Main Class
    Blue Mage Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by HisShadowX View Post
    snip
    For the healer thing, if you 1) don't die and 2) actually use all of your mitigation, you have nothing to worry about, pop your invuln if you're nervous. As the tank there is no challenge for you in that because your HP is for the healer to worry about, not you. You're saying good healers grind your gears.
    (9)
    im baby

  8. #128
    Player
    Rein_eon_Osborne's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2020
    Location
    Shadowflare - Ward Miasma II, Plot Broil IV
    Posts
    3,969
    Character
    Mira Clearweaver
    World
    Jenova
    Main Class
    Conjurer Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by HisShadowX View Post
    Three things that grind my gears are

    1)[...]

    2)[...]

    3)[...]
    #1 If you're not dying then it's all good. Their job is to keep you alive through unavoidable damage, not to top you off 99% of time. Heck if they're doing this even in big/wall pulls, they definitely knew what they're doing. Relax, you're in good hands!

    #2 I've answered this few pages earlier, but yes when they bring the mob to you there's definitely nothing to fuss about.

    #3 Perhaps Vote Dismiss is a good opt to consider at that point. I'm sorry to hear that you had to deal with these 'funny behavior'.

    Also, you double posted there, mate xD
    (5)
    Last edited by Rein_eon_Osborne; 03-27-2021 at 01:19 AM.

  9. #129
    Player
    BunniEclair's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2020
    Posts
    526
    Character
    Tea Cakes
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Rein_eon_Osborne View Post
    #1 If you're not dying then it's all good. Their job is to keep you alive through unavoidable damage, not to top you off 99% of time. Heck if they're doing this even in big/wall pulls, they definitely knew what they're doing. Relax, you're in good hands!
    This. I love tanks that trust me in Expert to know when to heal and when to dps. Watching a PLD start spamming clemency at 60% health when I have a bene waiting for them....

    If they die they can feel free to be mad about my lack of heals. It rarely happens but when it does I own up to it and apologize. (And 90% of the time it’s not because I was too busy dpsing, it’s because I turned to yell at my cat for eating plastic)
    (6)

  10. #130
    Player
    HisShadowX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Ul'dah
    Posts
    332
    Character
    William Hart
    World
    Jenova
    Main Class
    Samurai Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by ZedxKayn View Post
    For the healer thing, if you 1) don't die and 2) actually use all of your mitigation, you have nothing to worry about, pop your invuln if you're nervous. As the tank there is no challenge for you in that because your HP is for the healer to worry about, not you. You're saying good healers grind your gears.
    The issue with this concept is the majority of the healers who have the mentality of healing once the tank is below 15% typically it causes the tank to die numerous times and often can cause a wipe.

    I recently had a wipe after the Healer outright refused to heal and after his lack of healing caused my death and this proceeded for next critical 20 seconds to not heal anyone and keep DPSing. This is a problem and instead of healing he decided once EVERYONE was under 20% health only then did that person resurrect me. At that point I wondered what was the point in even resurrecting myself (which I clicked yes to) because once I finally came to everyone was pretty much dead.

    Very few parties I have ever been involved in with a healer who did this did it work out. Some are great multi taskers and that well enough but some seem to forget their role as healer and just flat out fail to heal.

    As a tank I should never die unless I messed up the mechanics or pulled way to much and typically I will judge my pulls according to if I notice a healer struggles through large or even medium pulls. I try to graciously go according to what my healer can handle and if it’s a new healer I work with them.
    (2)

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