FF14 devs just keep doing your thing because my god

[Shougun]

FFXIV has . . . class identity and feel.

Graphically I agree but I feel WoW has a lot of extra flair to their classes so I'd personally give class feel to WoW. Demon Hunters get wings, Death Knights can walk on water, Mages have portals, druids can transform into mount form mid air and in combat smoothly and can let others mount them, warlocks with their party teleport skill, etc, etc. There is something that constantly, usually, makes you feel special and reminds you of your class in WoW that honestly I don't feel consistently in FFXIV. Like being a red mage with dual cast and raise is a big highlight that makes you feel special, but that's not each job and some of their specials are not that emphasized. WoW sometimes messes this up really bad and produces some really bad balance for certain trees / classes.. (which is why I suggest FFXIV try to do this more on the role play / outdoorsy side) but I still think WoW, when it's not poorly balanced, has a stronger sense of class identity (gameplay 'vibe' wise, not visually).

I like the gameplay feeling of FFXIV over WoW, I've not played high end WoW in aaaaagggesss but I just remember my hunter's rotation being this mana hungry mess rather than the methodical fun dance in FFXIV. But I want to say I've not played in ages so, not sure how high end classes feel now.

I definfetly feel FFXIV could be inspired by some of WoW's desires to add identity to jobs. Like why does Dragoon take fall damage? Not that but perhaps he should be able to jump higher too. There are ways you can add flair without it messing things up, and far more carefully perhaps in actual combat too (although the combat differences are obviously the waaaaaaaay harder one to deal with, especially if you want to be concerned about end game content which is a good concern to have ).


Definitely agree to that last bit though that the end goal player is different in both games (well in general to all the other points as well, just not so much on the class identity- visually I'm reminded of my job, mechanically sometimes, but the feel and uses I get out of it even less so, I feel those feelings are flipped when I played WoW... looong ago lol. And some of those reasons are fair, balance in WoW, especially when I played way back when was like "what's balance? No seriously what is that? Can I eat it?". . It was reallllly bad for some jobs back then xD.).

[Rae88]

Graphically I agree but I feel WoW has a lot of extra flare to their classes so I'd personally give class feel to WoW. Demon Hunters get wings, Death Knights can walk on water, Mages have portals, druids can transform into mount form mid air and in combat smoothly and can let others mount them, warlocks with their party teleport skill, etc, etc. There is something that constantly, usually, makes you feel special and reminds you of your class in WoW that honestly I don't feel consistently in FFXIV. Like being a red mage with dual cast and raise is a big highlight that makes you feel special, but that's not each job and some of their specials are not that emphasized. WoW sometimes messes this up really bad and produces some really bad balance for certain trees / classes.. (which is why I suggest FFXIV try to do this more on the role play / outdoorsy side) but I still think WoW, when it's not poorly balanced, has a stronger sense of class identity (gameplay 'vibe' wise, not visually).

I like the gameplay feeling of FFXIV over WoW, I've not played high end WoW in aaaaagggesss but I just remember my hunter's rotation being this mana hungry mess rather than the methodical fun dance in FFXIV. But I want to say I've not played in ages so, not sure how high end classes feel now.

I definfetly feel FFXIV could be inspired by some of WoW's desires to add identity to jobs. Like why does Dragoon take fall damage? Not that but perhaps he should be able to jump higher too. There are ways you can add flare without it messing things up, and far more carefully perhaps in actual combat too (although the combat differences are obviously the waaaaaaaay harder one to deal with, especially if you want to be concerned about end game content which is a good concern to have ).


Definitely agree to that last bit though that the end goal player is different in both games (well in general to all the other points as well, just not so much on the class identity- visually I'm reminded of my job, mechanically sometimes, but the feel and uses I get out of it even less so, I feel those feelings are flipped when I played WoW... looong ago lol. And some of those reasons are fair, balance in WoW, especially when I played way back when was like "what's balance? No seriously what is that? Can I eat it?". . It was reallllly bad for some jobs back then xD.).

Wow has a different kinda problem with class feel. That is the community feels class identity in WoW has been lost in favour of spec identity, which has also helped in the button count pruning.

Like if you play as a Shadow Priest in WoW, it feels really hard to actually feel like a priest

[linayar]

There is something that constantly, usually, makes you feel special and reminds you of your class in WoW that honestly I don't feel consistently in FFXIV.

That's because WoW lacks something that is ingrained to FFXIV: the character of the WoL itself, which transcends any job. Mage portal, DH wing, DK walking on water would be things that the WoL can do (not exactly the same features, but the general idea) regardless of the job: teleporting/attuning with aetherytes/aethernets, flying and diving with any and all mounts, even switching jobs.

[Shougun]

Wow has a different kinda problem with class feel. That is the community feels class identity in WoW has been lost in favour of spec identity, which has also helped in the button count pruning.

Like if you play as a Shadow Priest in WoW, it feels really hard to actually feel like a priest

Yeah, we don't want that system :P. I don't think jobs need 'specs'. I just think the jobs need more flair, when possible (not harming balance).

Merely talking about the extra effort they went into flare for jobs. That doesn't happen so much here, and while some of it is because of balance (fair concern) there are plenty of opportunities to do so that wont hurt balance.

That's because WoW lacks something that is ingrained to FFXIV: the character of the WoL itself, which transcends any job. Mage portal, DH wing, DK walking on water would be things that the WoL can do (not exactly the same features, but the general idea) regardless of the job: teleporting/attuning with aetherytes/aethernets, flying and diving with any and all mounts, even switching jobs.

Sort of. When you're a dragoon you don't tank. Even though you're WoL you don't transcend your job in combat.

Certain features make sense to transcend jobs sure, but even then there is clearly room they could do more. Like Ninja has on all fours passive as an example. Dragoon could be rocking reduced fall damage, which would go in line with their identity of the lords of jump.

Another example is playing music doesn't transcend jobs.

I understand what you're trying to get it, but it's only sort of true and I don't think it hurts anyone if a dragoon could jump higher or take less fall damage simply to better give that job identity. Nor is it out of place concept in the game, given ninja passive or bard music.

[linayar]

Sort of. When you're a dragoon you don't tank. Even though you're WoL you don't transcend your job in combat.

Certain features make sense to transcend jobs sure, but even then there is clearly room they could do more. Like Ninja has on all fours passive as an example. Dragoon could be rocking reduced fall damage, which would go in line with their identity of the lords of jump.

Another example is playing music doesn't transcend jobs.

I understand what you're trying to get it, but it's only sort of true and I don't think it hurts anyone if a dragoon could jump higher or take less fall damage simply to better give that job identity. Nor is it out of place concept in the game, given ninja passive or bard music.

The easy explanation for playing music is that it's tied to your arms. That's how abilities are limited to certain jobs and is the one defining identity of a job or class in FFXIV.

And yes, there are other certain abilities that don't transcend jobs, like a dragoon cannot tank and a dragoon cannot cook either. But that's why the WoL isn't simply the WoL. It's not one or the other, but both. It's the WoL + whatever current job/class that is being used.