Have we given up on SCH?

[Saefinn]

Is a healer.
You can heal savage.
You can heal dungeons.
You can heal msq.
You can even do dps on all of that content.

Whats wrong?

I mean, there’s threads and threads that answer your question.

The main one is finding healing less and less interesting because there’s too much down time in the majority of content and what we do in our downtime is boring. The healing jobs feel less engaging than they used to and they feel like they’re getting more and more dumbed down. To the point some like myself have moved roles to avoid being bored so we can enjoy the job we play.

I started playing SCH on release of ARR and mained it since and it was a lot of fun to play as a job, but healing itself has felt like it has been watered down over time and making our downtime being greater. SCH has technically been OP since HW and whilst it was a novelty at first, OP gets boring when you’re a healer. And this expansion has made what we used to do in our downtime boring as heck, but I already found the healing aspect boring in SB, but still could at least weave a better variety of moves between heals, which I can no long do. There’s just little satisfaction in it anymore.

I’m a guy who loves playing healers and was happy with SCH and want to keep playing it but doesn’t enjoy it in its current state, so of course I’m going to try and push things get better.

[Tharnor]

That's part of the problem. Just because it can do its job well, doesn't mean it doesn't need a lot of work. Yes, it is one of,if not, the strongest healers atm, but your entire job is just "spam broil until tank gets big ouchie, then stop to excog or indom". Not to mention what they did to Selene, or how pointless Seraph feels, or w/e other problems scholar as that I don't feel like digging into atm because I need sleep. Are the problems as big as AST? Prolly not, doesn't mean they aren't big problems. I'd rather a class be bad, but incredibly fun and interesting to play, over one that gets the job done, but has nothing to do while doing it. Balance should come AFTER and only AFTER you've made the classes fun and unique. It should never come at the cost of what made the class fun in the first place.

A boring dps rotation is not something to cry over. It was boring before this change. Selene was already mostly trash outside of a very well setup group. Seraph was implemented in a weird way but still a viable cooldown. It is funny that you comment that you would rather be bad as long as it is fun. Bad classes have it so much worse. Go ask nin how they are liking being at the bottom of the totem pole this expansion. Or BLM for most of SB. Or pld in HW.

Would I like some changes? Yes but realistically it is not going to happen when so many other classes need significantly more developer time investment. But keep crying like a child. The dev's are ignoring you and I am not sure why I do not doing the same.

[Clouse_Cleyra]

Also people keep complaining about Seraph... Am I the only one that consider it a pretty strong healing move?

[EaMett]

I still try to bring it up where I can, but it's getting disheartening not hearing anything from the devs. "SCH is strong, so it's fine, it's balanced" etc. Completely ignoring all the issues we have with it.

._. I really wish the devs would say ANYTHING. What healers really need is a voice that isn't momo. Momo, as amazing at the game as he is, only cares about optimizing, everything else is second bananas, so long as SCH can optimize and do it well, then it will be fine in his eyes, and it'll be fine in the eyes of the people who follow him, so there needs to be a voice that opposes his that says "no, SCH and the other healers AREN'T fine", but gl to anyone who attempts to get the following, heh.

Momo said sch was fine? I recall him pointing out the fairy issues and the galvanize/catalyze order problem. Also he seems to be running his most successful speed runs on double WHM for the most part, so although that's not an indication that sch isn't alright it's still telling of a bit of a inbalance.

Also people keep complaining about Seraph... Am I the only one that consider it a pretty strong healing move?

I think seraph is fine, it's an ogcd succor shield, I'll take it. I wouldn't call it "strong" by any measure but it compliments the rest of our kit really well and needs a bit of planning. Actually feels nice to use imo as it saves a gcd, but that's only in raiding as it loses most of it's appeal in dungeons.

[vtndll]

Yes, I have given up on sch, and healers in general this expansion. Sch has been my main since heavensward and I haven't really been on it this expansion.

I might be the only one that feels this way, but I would have preferred square enix changed nothing and just left healers in their stormblood state this expansion then implement these changes. I believe if they would have done that and bolted on 3-4 new skills you get from 70-80 it would have been more "balanced" than what we currently got.

[Saefinn]

Also people keep complaining about Seraph... Am I the only one that consider it a pretty strong healing move?

Not massively strong, but useful and I like Seraph.


In actuality I like SCH's healing toolkit, I prefer what in terms of actual healing spells this time around to how it was in Stormblood. But one of the issues is that I don't really have a need to utilise them for most content. As I've said before in these threads. One of three things needs to happen:

1) The content pushes us to better utilise our healing toolkit and to push us to optimise how we heal more, to make healing more engaging and reduce our downtime. (This would be a logistical problem with existing content)
2) Jobs are adjusted & balanced so healing is less efficient so we are pushed to utilise our healing tool more so we can increase our efficiency as healers and reduce our downtime.
3) We accept that downtime is a thing and they make our downtime interesting. (This would arguably be the easy fix & doesn't negatively impact less experienced healers or those learning things like savage)

[DenzelVilliers]

Who the hell is Momo?, i see that everytime someone says anything about Healers that they disagree, that person is considered a "Momo disciple" or something like that, i never heard about Momo in my life, it'sa Streamer?, a Youtuber?, the only one i know is Mizteqq for some Guides.

Anyway...

Also people keep complaining about Seraph... Am I the only one that consider it a pretty strong healing move?

Seraph is by far the best Healer Lv80 skill while WHM's Temperance is the worst, really, especially in Dungeons i never use Temperance at all because isn't necessary. Temperance +5% Damage Potency would be a lot better and usefull than +10% Damage Reduction.

I don't see any reason to complain about Seraph when you have Temperance and Neutral Sect in other hand, like i said, in general SCH is already in a perfect spot and people are mostly asking for old skill to come back and more buttons to smash and claming that as a "issue", because "the job is boring to play" instead a real issue in their skills, SCH real issues has already been fixed like spaming heals to build Fairy Gauge and huge MP amout for Arts of War, while WHM and AST are the ones at this moment who really need some fix, but 90% of time someone ask for a WHM fix people say, for example: "Did Momo said that?", "WHM is OP needs a nerf", "WHM has nothing wrong with it" and etc.

Every single day there's at least a new thread about SCH, if people want Shadow, Bane and etc back, create a Thread including all Healers, asking fot Aero III as well, a new AST AoE DoT that never had as well, because they deserves it too. A 4th Healer is never going to see the daylight while people ask for unbalanced stuff, and i want a 4th healer.

[Billythepancake]

A boring dps rotation is not something to cry over. It was boring before this change. Selene was already mostly trash outside of a very well setup group. Seraph was implemented in a weird way but still a viable cooldown. It is funny that you comment that you would rather be bad as long as it is fun. Bad classes have it so much worse. Go ask nin how they are liking being at the bottom of the totem pole this expansion. Or BLM for most of SB. Or pld in HW.

Would I like some changes? Yes but realistically it is not going to happen when so many other classes need significantly more developer time investment. But keep crying like a child. The dev's are ignoring you and I am not sure why I do not doing the same.

Selene was trash in Savage, but what about other content where you practically never healed? I did maps the other day, had 5 people with poison and one with a slow, and I thought "wow, I really wish I still had that aoe esuna, so I didn't have to go an individually esuna every single person here".and even if it was trash, instead of doing the better solution of making her viable in all content, as eos was, while making her different and giving us a choice, like SMN has with its pets, they just gutted her.

Seraph is just rouse, with 2 oGCD succors. Even in Savage, she's not incredibly useful. I've found one or two uses per fight with her, other than that, she's pointless.

PLD is still a popular class, BLM was popular the entirety of SB. People played AST on release, despite it being garbage, because of how unique and different and fun it was. When something is fun, you'll find a way to make it work, if it's boring, why would you ever want to?

[Billythepancake]

Also people keep complaining about Seraph... Am I the only one that consider it a pretty strong healing move?

Rouse with 2 succors. Not weak, but it's disappointing, it should not have been a capstone ability,it's not game changing in the slightest. Remove Seraph and I could do all content fine. Recitation is actually the only good move I consider SCH got this expac, and that is something I would consider a capstone ability, because it changes the game, I would have to completely rework heals if they got rid of it.

[Billythepancake]

Who the hell is Momo?, i see that everytime someone says anything about Healers that they disagree, that person is considered a "Momo disciple" or something like that, i never heard about Momo in my life, it'sa Streamer?, a Youtuber?, the only one i know is Mizteqq for some Guides.

Anyway...



Seraph is by far the best Healer Lv80 skill while WHM's Temperance is the worst, really, especially in Dungeons i never use Temperance at all because isn't necessary. Temperance +5% Damage Potency would be a lot better and usefull than +10% Damage Reduction.

I don't see any reason to complain about Seraph when you have Temperance and Neutral Sect in other hand, like i said, in general SCH is already in a perfect spot and people are mostly asking for old skill to come back and more buttons to smash and claming that as a "issue", because "the job is boring to play" instead a real issue in their skills, SCH real issues has already been fixed like spaming heals to build Fairy Gauge and huge MP amout for Arts of War, while WHM and AST are the ones at this moment who really need some fix, but 90% of time someone ask for a WHM fix people say, for example: "Did Momo said that?", "WHM is OP needs a nerf", "WHM has nothing wrong with it" and etc.

Every single day there's at least a new thread about SCH, if people want Shadow, Bane and etc back, create a Thread including all Healers, asking fot Aero III as well, a new AST AoE DoT that never had as well, because they deserves it too. A 4th Healer is never going to see the daylight while people ask for unbalanced stuff, and i want a 4th healer.

"Others have bad abilities too, why complain about your bad ability?" And honestly, if they never release a 4th healer, I find it'd be for the best. They can't handle 3. They completely gutted AST and SCH of everything that made them fun and unique for the sake of "balance" (good job btw, square, healers are still unbalanced, with the meta for the as prevalent as it has always been, just changed who was in the meta) and still haven't addressed any of the problems WHM has had for YEARS. Why on Earth would I ever want a 4th healer thrown into that mix? Just so they can gut the classes even more for the sake of "balance"?