Sexual harassment

[NephthysVasudan]

I find this thread utterly hilarious and over the top drama troll bait.
#EDIT it seems some people stop reading and "disengage brain" at this point - Keep reading and save yourself the trouble and the money on headache medication later. EDIT#
Simply because the amount of ignorance/shock/awe this has produced over those who have read it.


Lets stop and think about this for a second:
If you think this is a "NEW" thing? Your horribly wrong....what rock did you crawl out form under? Seriously?
If you think this is a "RAMPANT" problem - Well that depends on how much you see. Truth be told this has been around a VERY long time.
If you think SE is sitting here twiddling their thumbs and doing nothing about this....your just flat out of your minds.

I don't mean to be terse but its common sense here...at least I thought it was.
Sexual Harassment is a problem yes... yes its bad. But the problem is when people don't bother to do anything about it.

Look its this simple:
1: If it happens - you report it by filing a harassment petition. You black list them...and you move along.
2: If you find it so reprensible you do the above and you contact local law enforcement and you press charges.

Period. End of story.

For people to be up in arms is a waste of time...yes....it happens...its happening every second...every hour...every day.
So do something about it.
SE can only lift a finger if its reported.
You do nothing about it...nothing gets done.

Course this goes without saying...falsely accusing will cost you.
Do I take offense to this? Yes. Can I do anything about it? Only if I see it...and its not consensual..but who am I to judge?
I know this much...most cases are easily solved by blacklisting.
If it happens in real life... you call the cops....at least in this country. (USA)
Anything else is just hot air and asking for trolls.

Like it or not people are free to express themselves...to..a...point.
Thankfully this game has certain mechanics that limit that.

But if its getting out of hand..you contact a GM.

Women..AND...Men..have rights.
Use them.
Stop shifting the blame/fear/concern off someone else...let alone drama bombing it.
Not intending to offend people but I find it horribly wrong that this is now "the threadnaught of the month" when I've been seeing this trash for many many years.

Ok...you see it....now do something about it. Yelling at SE is a waste of time. You already have the tools. Use them.

[Anatha]

The sheer number of abuse apologists in this thread has made me sick to my stomach. The only thing that would ever drive a person to bear that standard is them seeing themselves in the abuser.

Stop standing on the wrong side of things. There are absolutes. Some things are just plain wrong, no matter what. Stop defending it, stop dismissing it.

[Anatha]

Abusers do not come at you with fangs bared. They come at you with smiles.


If you're ignorant of that singularly important fact, you're better off not voicing a malformed opinion on the topic.

[KaivaC]

snip

I'm sorry, but first off, this is nothing in this thread that should be remotely considered hilarious by any means. Not the context of the thread, not the responses made by posters thus far, not any of it. Second, this thread has probably brought more awareness of this back into the spotlight, that yes, this can and has happened.

When something occurs outside of the game, like Discord or even at the Moogle Post, there is really nothing a GM can do. And again, it is not that simple to call law enforcement if you're in the thick of things while you're in an emotionally vulnerable position. A lot of people are not understanding that some people find it incredibly difficult to call law enforcement or help. This has less to do with common sense and more to do with people who are victims being unable, whether emotionally or rationally, to take those steps towards getting out of some situations.

[Redname]

Again, I don't see how this is a FFXIV problem. If you think you can sue someone over harassment, then do it. But don't cry about it on FFXIV. You have more than enough ways to stop someone from bothering you. Again, this is online. Stop conflating it with real abuse. You can quite easily walk away from someone.

God you are even reading? I think your problem here is you never experienced something so intense. You never had a strong, deep relationship. Or you never trusted someone or put yourself in a vulnerable situation. Which is really sad cause you dont know how love feels.

You repeat and repeat like a parrot, that is victim fault. People can manipulate and use you and your feels to the point some people commit suicide. Then what, that is no abuse either? Turning the power off wont erase your relationship with that person or what you did with them (sexting, nudes, etc).

You can say is the victim fault. However I think they have enough shame and self hurt themselves for you to add more to the fire.
You can say its stupid they did that. Well yeah it is. But they didnt apply logic but feels. Now are you going to tell me you NEVER acted based on feels or did stupid things? Idk if you are a robot ,an AI or havent a pinch of sensitivity. But human beings need love and affection. And if someone take advantage of you using your needs...Well i think it shouldnt be defended like you did.
I think you lack a lot of experience. Go out and get some before shaming victims

[BillyKaplan]

I'm sorry, but first off, this is nothing in this thread that should be remotely considered hilarious by any means.

This a billion times over.

A lot of people are not understanding that some people find it incredibly difficult to call law enforcement or help. This has less to do with common sense and more to do with people who are victims being unable, whether emotionally or rationally, to take those steps towards getting out of some situations.

I'm going to expand on that a bit. To certain demographics, calling law enforcement is a hazard in and of itself. People of color; immigrants; queer and transsexual people; and heaven forbid if you're a cross between any of those groups. How often do we hear stories of people of color in the US who called the police, only to be thought to be the culprits of the crime they were reporting? If not shot outright?
Telling people to call the authorities comes from a position of privilege many victims of abuse do not benefit from.

[Baingoleth]

shaming victims

This keeps coming up in reply to some posts recommending that victims block, report, move on and be more careful in the future when someone starts to get creepy. I don't think most of the people giving that advice are trying to shame the victims. Rather, the impression that I get is that they are trying to advise preventative measures in the future. Sure, some of those posters are rather blunt but I don't think it means they don't care.

There are some posters in this thread who come across as uncaring and crass but they aren't trying to provide practical advice to prevent bad situations from escalating to sexual abuse. What they are doing is making jokes.

I see many posters in this thread who agree that sexual abuse is a terrible thing and also agree that it starts with manipulating people who already trust them. They just don't think anything more needs to be done other than educating people to be more cautious and even cut ties when someone you meet online starts to get creepy. Having that position isn't victim shaming even though the people who hold it might not be interested in showing empathy. The reality is that there are decent people who agree that sexual harassment is wrong but won't get emotionally involved unless the victim is someone close to them.

[NephthysVasudan]

<snip>

You should read my post in full next time.
You'll find it makes you less foolish over all.
Because you just repeated what I said.

[Reinha]

A lot of people are not understanding that some people find it incredibly difficult to call law enforcement or help.

I think a lot of people do understand that it's difficult. But what then? What is society supposed to do for victims who won't reveal their situation or ask for help? Vulnerable people who get preyed on have all my sympathies but my sympathy won't get them to safety or heal the damage that continues being done.

[BillyKaplan]

I think a lot of people do understand that it's difficult. But what then? What is society supposed to do for victims who won't reveal their situation or ask for help? Vulnerable people who get preyed on have all my sympathies but my sympathy won't get them to safety or heal the damage that continues being done.

Mob mentality is actually useful in this situation, as much as people (rightly) call it out on being dangerous as well. Peer pressure works. Financial boycotting works. Angry feedback that goes to companies, organization, social groups associated with the abuser works. All the more so in situations where as far as the law's concerned, you can't make a case over some technicality. And the intervention of people who care for the victim doesn't always work, true, but oftentimes it does. It might not stop the abuser from abusing people but it might save that particular victim. There are many, many shades of grey in this situation and you get a couple more every time you shift perspectives, looking at a different aspect of the situation.