4.25 and beyond

[Musashidon]

LoL, again, XIV 1.0 failed/almost bankrupted(really?) the company because it was far from finished.

people repeat this but it means nothing if the game was so good and just needed some touch up how would a few small patches to make things better get 490k players to join and stay?(a number to match ff14 arr at its lowest ever) i mean the content was already amazing as you said so what was the big thing that stop people from enjoying the game like you did?

there is only 1 excuse i can truely see as *game breaking for most people* that stop people from playing and that was you needed a great computer to play the game but would just lowering the graphic for bad computers (not even consoles just computers) so more people could play would that have saved the game?

[ShanXiv]

people repeat this but it means nothing if the game was so good and just needed some touch up how would a few small patches to make things better get 490k players to join and stay?(a number to match ff14 arr at its lowest ever) i mean the content was already amazing as you said so what was the big thing that stop people from enjoying the game like you did?

First, you are misleading something.
10K ONLINE players(actually, it was 16k-25k) =/= 10k total players,
there was 800-1500 ONLINE players in my server , (now, it's 1.5k-3k maybe)

16k-25k * 4-5, that's ~70k-100k players were playing XIV 1.2x
1.0 had sold about 500-600k copies? ~15-20% players were keep playing the game

now it's 10m players, but only 490k stay? lol.... that's 4.9%, many people came here, then moved to the next fotm games, and you call this successful?
I think XI had the same amount of players during its prime time.

[Musashidon]

First, you are misleading something.

no i am not 1.2 ended with only 10k players total these are SE own numbers not mine.

also we are above 500k currently not sure how much as we only get vague numbers when i use the number 500k its as a lowest ever number not a current number.
last i heard i think yoshi p put us at about 1 million not sure someone will prolly fact check me eventually.

10 million accounts made take that as you will not players total ever. it's a hype thing se does to get people to play sort of like WoW uses the whole 100million accounts made but they only hold a couple million players so yea retention is about the same.

everyone has their own idea of successful being the second largest mmo isn't being successful? well idk i can't really argue against your opinion seems alittle moot.

[ShanXiv]

no i am not 1.2 ended with only 10k players total these are SE own numbers not mine.

also we are above 500k currently not sure how much as we only get vague numbers when i use the number 500k its as a lowest ever number not a current number.
last i heard i think yoshi p put us at about 1 million not sure someone will prolly fact check me eventually.

10 million accounts made take that as you will not players total ever. it's a hype thing se does to get people to play sort of like WoW uses the whole 100million accounts made but they only hold a couple million players so yea retention is about the same.

everyone has their own idea of successful being the second largest mmo isn't being successful? well idk i can't really argue against your opinion seems alittle moot.

10k(16K)online players =/= total players ....
... LOL ,ok say whatever you want,

some facts:
1.2x, 11players in my FC were online


1.2x an open world party content, it was danger & fun. (now what? FATEs?)


1.2x a player event ,protect Ul'dah! (they are lovely aren't they)


1.2x, before server shut down, people stayed until the end


ARR launch, my FC(most of them came from 1.x) , the hype was high, and because 1.2x contents werer fun, we had high hopes for the future,


current XIV, only 5/249 players in my FC, are online, server isn't going shut down, but where are the people

[Bourne_Endeavor]

snip

You realize I can log into Balmung right now and take screenshots with more than triple the amount in the clips you showed from 1.0, yes? None of this proves 1.x more successful. What does prove its failure is despite being free, people still refused to stick around. They literally couldn't give the game away due to horrendously poor coding and design. Furthermore, you are comparing people's complaints now to fresh 1.x. When ARR released, few complained about it being stale and boring. These complaints have come after four years. Your whole comparison comes across incredibly disingenuous. And quite frankly, reeks of bias.

[VanilleFang]

5/249

So are you saying like 200 players thought 1.x was better than ARR? So 200 people enjoy obviously broken games, and performance issues, and maps that were literal mazes? There is a reason ARR came to be and why it is considered one of, if not, the biggest come backs in gaming history.

Still 200ish players thought it was better and left. What is SE ever going to do? Obviously your FC is representative of the entire population as a whole! Yes where are all the people? Oh right, they're in Limsa Lominsa.

[Vhailor]

people repeat this but it means nothing if the game was so good and just needed some touch up how would a few small patches to make things better get 490k players to join and stay?(a number to match ff14 arr at its lowest ever) i mean the content was already amazing as you said so what was the big thing that stop people from enjoying the game like you did?

there is only 1 excuse i can truely see as *game breaking for most people* that stop people from playing and that was you needed a great computer to play the game but would just lowering the graphic for bad computers (not even consoles just computers) so more people could play would that have saved the game?

Depends on what SE's goals for the game were.

With a property like Final Fantasy, SE can pursue a wide variety of goals with their titles. They can release AAA original efforts that remind people of how great the franchise can be. They can revisit older titles, remaking them or offering expansions. Or, they can milk the franchise name and release uninspired content cheaply and rapidly.

If SE's goals for FFXIV was the latter, then no, the only way to fix FFXIV was to re-release it a la 2.0. If their goal was to create a AAA original effort, I don't think XIV 1.0 was all that far off, with their primary issue being the utterly atrocious job they did on the game's graphics engine, UI responsiveness, server code, etc. Put some time into resolving that (not killing the polygon counts and reworking the graphics engine; simply optimizing it), and XIV 1.0 had a really solid foundation. Give it a Zilart-calibre expansion and fix the back-end problems, and the game's off and running as a natural successor to FFXI.

Also, as an aside, people are far too harsh, generally speaking, when they judge MMOs at launch. Virtually every MMO in the world really takes an expansion or two before it comes into its own. In that respect, FFXIV 2.0 was really like XIV's first expansion, just a very ambitious one; a lot of the work was already done, so the team was free to mostly focus on content and polish. It also took quite a while for ARR to find its footing, despite its unique advantages (pre-existing user base from XI and XIV 1.x; membership in a big-name franchise; easier development than many MMOs due to its reduced scope).

[Musashidon]

Or, they can milk the franchise name and release uninspired content cheaply and rapidly.

how do you milk a name? i say this as we watched 1.0 flop and noone want to play it despite being final fantasy.


i am not saying the content in the game are all master pieces but one thing didn't work and another did.

i don't see how content is uninspired in the current ff14 while yes you can 123 through most of it there are always interesting new mechanics and idea all the time from every different primal/raid to sometime just normal dungeons. when people complain about content it's never that the idea lacks its that the idea doesn't easily kill the player. the complaints are the game is easy and the mechs can be pretty much ignored but that is the complaint.

like with the fate hate people love fates they just hate that people can zerg them and they don't screw players over as if that is the only thing that matters.

the re-release of ff14 has shown people all over the world how great of a game SE can make.

people keep bring up xi as some king game but when people actually talk about it you had the choice of running something like 5 different things for gear for 5 years plus but current ff14 gives you 12 raids per 2 years 3 24 player raids per 2 years up to 10 dungeons (a little less with the current content creation plan) and something like 6 primals per 2 years and the complaint is simply that the gear doesn't last long enough.

yes 5 things is way better and less boring simply because the gear lasts for years.

judge to harshly? ff14 1.0 i will say didn't get thrown onto anything and everything it could to get attention sure i can say that but didn't have the ffxi player base behind it? umm i keep hearing how the ff11 player base loved 1.0, a big named franchise? hmmmm? easier development that many mmo's due to its reduced scope, well you got me here for i have no idea what you mean unless you mean they decided to take out the 99% copy pasted map that prolly took 15 seconds to put in place, idk what game needs a flower pot with so many pixels it can crash a computer.

some facts:

i am sorry you believe your friends not liking the game means it's dying, i am sorry you believe posting a couple pictures and you saying i am wrong makes 1.2 have 100k players magically.

[Vhailor]

how do you milk a name? i say this as we watched 1.0 flop and noone want to play it despite being final fantasy.


i am not saying the content in the game are all master pieces but one thing didn't work and another did.

i don't see how content is uninspired in the current ff14 while yes you can 123 through most of it there are always interesting new mechanics and idea all the time from every different primal/raid to sometime just normal dungeons. when people complain about content it's never that the idea lacks its that the idea doesn't easily kill the player. the complaints are the game is easy and the mechs can be pretty much ignored but that is the complaint.

like with the fate hate people love fates they just hate that people can zerg them and they don't screw players over as if that is the only thing that matters.

Difficulty is a component, but the sense I've gotten, and perhaps you've gotten a different one, is that people are bored with the content itself. These two go hand in hand to an extent, though, because literally the only meaningful, differentiating factor between Rabanastre and Labyrinth of the Ancients is boss mechanics. There's no difference in party composition, no difference in objective styling, no difference in ability usage (beyond the level capped abilities), no difference in pace. It's just the mechanics. Which guarantees two things: firstly, that Rabanastre (or any other 24-person fight) becomes quite boring, quite quickly; secondly, that Rabanastre becomes easy quite quickly, because there's nothing new to master beyond a different boss rotation to memorize.

If you look at FATEs, too, the complaint lurking behind 'they're too easy to zerg' is that they're brainless and boring, not that they're easy. Suggestions to make FATEs impact the world if they aren't completed have less to do with difficulty, and more to do with depth of experience, with a desire to feel invested in the content.

And this sort of crap is how a company milks a name. The update cycle for FFXIV looks a lot like Assassin's Creed. Shovel the same old crap on an accelerated release cycle, over and over and over as long as people are willing to keep paying for it. Don't bother with changing things up or expanding the experience in a meaningful way; that's not necessary, and requires too much time and money. Just keep repeating things until profits begin to suffer (which they will at some point, rest assured). And it isn't what XIV 1.0 did, if for no other reason than 1.0 wasn't allowed to exist long enough to fall into this sort of cycle. ARR felt fresh, too. I didn't mind 2.0, nor, I think, did most people. It's everything that's happened since that has people rightly concerned with the future of the title.

[Musashidon]

Difficulty is a component.

in any game if you choose a class/job whatever they want to call them players will make a guide to play them the right way and any other way is the wrong way, and in games like xi where every job is gives loads and loads of skills there are even more wrong choices to choose. we all remember the 2.0 ifrit fiasco where parties disbanded for having no mages or two warriors. people downright refuse to play without the optimal team, warrior was completely changed from its orginal creation over being too hard to play in end game content and people having to play better because of it.

fates this is what i said, they want them to not be zergable and to screw people over in the map by making quests or something needed inaccessible for no reason. they are constantly changing how fates work and adding new idea's too them from what makes certain fates spawn to what happens in them like the on in the peaks that is a giant robot you have to defeat before it reaches its destination but the only way that fate would be good is if it ended in town and blew it up making you have to do a whole nother fate to get the town back to do main scenario.

it comes down to the same two aspects being the only thing that matters and then people say no thought was put into this content! what do you mean no thought? SE has decided making quests disappear and people needing to hope someone will help them reopen the area is to cruel to do and would more likely hurt the playerbase instead of build it up, because while people like the idea they don't like the idea of having to go back to old content that isn't important anymore and helping a newbie with no incentives but it's a cool idea that it does this annoying thing.

why does ff14 have to change but it was terrible for ff11 to change? you have to change the formula! except for the games i like don't change them!

like i said earlier 1.0 died do to noone playing it, it got so bad yoshi p said hey if you guys can hold the bare minimum to keep this game running we will keep it and they weren't able too. so sure maybe 1.0 would have been the same over and over and yea i believe it would as you don't change a game for no reason you made the game to be that way why would you randomly decide to change core gameplay for no reason?

concerned with the future of the title? in what way that it won't go the way you want it to or that it may stop being successful one day?

All of which ignores that this isn't even the subject of this thread, which is decidedly in the realm of breaking the status quo and not doubling down by adding in more of what we've already got for the nth time.

why do you think it's ok to make ff14 different but not 11? you may not believe that but i am asking what you think the general idea about the casual change to 11 is that it was terrible and that it completely ruined the game but then says if 14 was changed into 11 it would make the game better and awesome.

and you said here is break the status qou do something different ok but why is it ok for 14 but not a game that you may like?

from what i am getting is it comes down to the idea that people like the way one game is and all games have to follow that formula or at least FF because FF can't deviate from what they like and when it does it's uncreative and uninspired.

so what i am saying is if no game is allowed to do the same thing over and over that means the games you like their current design and direction also has to change to the opposite because it continuing to do what it does is uncreative and uninspired. double standards in all.