Black Mage

[Llugen]

If we go with my previous Firestorm/Thunderstorm suggestion, then Fire IV > Fire IV > Fire from 3 Umbral Hearts will always result in a Firestarter, regardless of RNG.

While the example still uses RNG the point is that it's still less punishing to do two instant cast Fires back to back than it would be to do Scathe Scathe. You still WANT to use Fire IV and not move, but closing the punishment gap is extremely important. I am much happier with Scathe as an "execute" as something is about to die (with its current MP cost) and instead adjusting Fire I (imagine then that on the move the class would play like an instant cast 2.0 BLM) rather than trying to make Scathe into a pretend-Fire I during Astral and a Blizzard during Umbral. In my opinion, that is much better saved for Thunder/Thundercloud, which you also want to use for movement if possible.

[Ali5553]

instant casting fire4 while moving would be ideal, but i don't think they will go with something like that since its quite some changes.TBH if they want to make a pure dps class then they should be more aggressive with the potency they assign to said classes skills/spells. its always better to overshoot and later fine tune. regardless, my solution is more aimed towards the preserving enochian and your rotation after movement. making it less of a hassle.

[Llugen]

The job should be punished for moving, just not so drastically as it is right now. Note that currently if you have to use Scathe you lose the MP table to cast another Fire IV and then you also have to cast an additional Fire to refresh the timer, so you in essence lose TWO Fire IV.

Compare this to SMN that loses a whopping 30 potency between Ruin III and Ruin II (or NONE if there's a Further Ruin proc, not to mention it can do a lap around the entire arena during DWT), and RDM which can move every other cast and Dualcast into Swiftcast for an extended movement, and utilize Corps/Displacement if necessary. And of course, BRD/MCH lose nothing from moving since #RIPBowWizard. This discrepancy is direly problematic.

[Shiroe]

@ Tzain


smn dot aoe damage is part if its sustained aoe, but smn has insane burst, that can be held on too till the time is right..., smn 3.x aoe was more if a "dot" aoe tham now, 4.x smn changed


blm start to lose their long aoe build up (precast b3, b4, sharp, thunder, fire3), when they cast any fire moves (their main dps) before the aoe starts..., they can only hold on to a thunder proc (for w limited time).., timing the long build up is a pain .. and than blm cant even sustain after the ling build up, cause adds burn to fast in every duty/raid (atleast expect fractal hard to have some sustained aoe phases)

@ SS increase, could be a fast fix, adding more dps and being more mobile with faster casts..., we'd have to use B4 for mp ticks now (making B4 more valid)., just Foul would need a 20- 25 sec build up

[Remedi]

Well for now, unless some odd shenanigans on their end, it seems that F4 cast time will be lowered again so there's that

[Ali5553]

how will that work with the spell speed gear? if they go with lower casting time fire 4. so it will be another DH and DET/Crit stacking class. I would like to see a more creative solution that tackles the fundamental problems with the class.

[Llugen]

@Shiroe, Refer to my post on the last page about how to address BLM aoe issues. Dropping the reliance on Transpose/server ticks with Sub-Zero and granting the Umbral Hearts for two Flares guaranteed every time without needing to hardcast Blizzard IV would be a huge gain, plus the Firestarter to get back into Astral rather than having to hardcast Fire III. On top of this, Thundersting would make great use of rapid Thundercloud procs with Thunder IV.

It still wouldn't be quite as burst-y as Summon Bahamut and two Painflares + Bane, but it would be on MUCH more equal footing.


One huge problem with BLM AoE right now (and since 3.0 really) is that hardcasting Fire III and somewhat Blizzard IV are required parts of the rotation. So you have a massive mob in front of you but in order to change stance/charge up you have to cast single target spells...? (and hardcast one of the longest casts, too, since Umbral Ice I is all you get from Transpose) This is straight up horrible design, not to mention in 3.0 it was even worse because it meant you could only use Enochian for the first 30 seconds and then you lost it.

Sub-Zero alone would virtually fix this, since it would mean no more need to rely on server ticks for MP, you're granted Umbral Ice III and three Umbral Hearts so no need to cast Blizzard IV, and then your Fire III will be either instant cast (Firestarter granted for Umbral Hearts consumed as per Firestorm) or at LEAST fast-cast since you're in Umbral Ice III.

[Neela]

oh some hours later it turned into a discussion what really matters and whats just shortviewed - at your service glad to trigger ;3

[Sfia]

Sounds like maybe we've been heard \o/ I hope the changes coming up in 4.2 properly hit the problems so many people have brought up in here.

[Remedi]

Even though I'm supportive of the dev team, I'll keep my expectations extremely low