Black Mage

[Remedi]

The stacking of damage buffs (Hypercharge + Foe Requiem + Trick Attack + Chain Stratagem all on two minute timers (or one minute, which still means they will be up during the two minute mark)) is the biggest reason that synergy turns into meta when considering utility like this. This is why all classes should bring some utility, even if it isn't quite as strong as others, so you can at least work with it rather than say it contributes NOTHING, which is exactly what BLM contributes right now. "Damage" doesn't count, as I laid out already.

The idea of selfish dps is that your dmg is so good that jobs offering buffs feeds your, because your potency gain is bigger than the others in the end.
It does work in some situation, but as you mention atm the buff stacking is too strong, IF they were to nerf the aoe buffs and buff the single target ones things will easily change
The point is if that's the vision of SE there are only 2 roads, either they comply with it and really make so selfish dps are the ACE of the group or they make everyone give some sort of buffs, which honestly I'll be frank is just as boring

There's also the third way that is removing buffs altogether btw

[BlackcatChen]

As much as I'd LOVE direct damage buffs on BLM to bring it up to par, I don't think it'll ever happen. Why? It would make BLM (and SAM) completely broken in single player and 4 man content. SAM & BLM duo as DPS in regular dungeon would mean boss-phase-skipping amounts of DPS compared to "normal" comps. Or that's what my gut tells me, I haven't done the number crunching.

The way I see it is that we need some group-buffing offensive utility or we'll remain as the worst(?) option for serious content.

If you're going to balance that way... then even having purely damage dealing classes doesn't even make sense.

[Llugen]

Well in the case of the "ace", BLM is even worse off because it has no synergy with 2 minute CDs like hypercharge and stratagem (ley lines is 90 seconds) and it doesn't even have a real burst phase at all now that it is without raging strikes.

I'd much sooner see all jobs get utility of some kind (I mean, if nothing else SAM technically has slashing if the party is DRK/PLD) than see all utility removed from all jobs, although it would be nice if there were better synergy options, particularly with regards to piercing and DRG/MCH/BRD

[Alexalibur]

Should we look into Scathe? Seriously, it's a skill that is supposed to be our "movement" skill yet it costs a bit of MP which messes up our AF cycle and does almost no damage enough to warrant the loss of MP, adding the fact that you only need to move for like 1 second and end up standing for 1.5 seconds waiting and potentially screwing up your timers. It's too much of a hassle that nobody uses it unless you're gonna be moving for more than 2 seconds like in second boss of Shisui.

I feel that it could be changed into something more than its current niche place. Maybe it adds 3 seconds to AF/UI per usage and an enhanced Scathe completely refreshes the timers. Increasing the potency for a bit is an idea, too.

[NovaLevossida]

As much as I'd LOVE direct damage buffs on BLM to bring it up to par, I don't think it'll ever happen. Why? It would make BLM (and SAM) completely broken in single player and 4 man content. SAM & BLM duo as DPS in regular dungeon would mean boss-phase-skipping amounts of DPS compared to "normal" comps. Or that's what my gut tells me, I haven't done the number crunching.

Hmmmm... Is that serious?

[Llugen]

It is true that BLM is absolutely the best thing to take for dungeons.

[Remedi]

Can't consider slashing a synergy of SAM at all since NIN brings it (and we already said that his spot won't be taken by anyone), dunno if NIN wants to still skip slashing but both SAM and WAR have slashing embedded in their kit that (especially on WAR) there's no way it falls off anyway.

@SQuigley No offense but when POTD 2.0 or any savage 4 man content will come out RDM and SMN will wipe the dust with BLM there too.
Especially if there's something like 180+ floors of POTD in the future the safety net that a RDM brings will simply makes BLM obsolete, tehre's a reason why 190+ solo are done by RDM only
As much as I believe that overall BLM is not a real hindarance in savage and you can do conent with it, I do agree that there are some problems and other options are better and in serious 4 man content even a incredibile dmg buff won't cut it atm

@Alexalibur: Scathe is a victim of the power creep, it might have had a place in ARR when potency were in check mostly but not it simply doesn't cut it. Llugen did had a proposed chance to make it extend tha duration of AF/UI which I agree would make it useful, more than the actual effect tbh.
Personally I would add a bit of a power boost OR removing the mana cost altogether

[Squigley]

Hmmmm... Is that serious?

I fail to see your point. Based on what I've seen so far in this game, the devs take regular dungeons seriously too.

As much as I believe that overall BLM is not a real hindarance in savage and you can do conent with it, I do agree that there are some problems and other options are better and in serious 4 man content even a incredibile dmg buff won't cut it atm

Yeah, that's the point I was trying to make. The current "balancing" model is broken.

[NovaLevossida]

I fail to see your point. Based on what I've seen so far in this game, the devs take regular dungeons seriously too.

You're talking about the content people queue into with random strangers and the difficulty is set so low you can drag a dead healer to a clear. No one cares what pops up in 4-man roulettes except for Aurum Vale, so naturally I had to wonder if you were serious.

[Squigley]

You're talking about the content people queue into with random strangers and the difficulty is set so low you can drag a dead healer to a clear. No one cares what pops up in 4-man roulettes except for Aurum Vale, so naturally I had to wonder if you were serious.

Ah, I see. And I do agree with you, ATM balancing for 4-man is stupid. But if/whan savage level 4-man comes... Well, we'll see.