Take it easy, Tanks.

[Maeka]

...

I suppose it also depends on the class. PLD turning on Sword Oath? Uh, no. Just.... don't. Keep Shield Oath on, because Sword Oath is... not anything you'd want for its awesome deeps (Sword Oath is for Off-Tanking so you don't build too much threat, and for Solo because you build Oath much faster so you can keep spamming Sheltron and Clemency to make yourself invincible). Since I have no experience playing a Warrior, and since the person you are referring to is a Warrior, they were speaking from a Warrior's PoV.

A PLD's Shield Oath gives far more defensive power than a Warrior's tank stance, and a Warrior's DPS stance increases DPS by more than a PLD's Sword Oath from my understanding (I could be wrong about this, but eh).

[Tridus]

A PLD's Shield Oath gives far more defensive power than a Warrior's tank stance, and a Warrior's DPS stance increases DPS by more than a PLD's Sword Oath from my understanding (I could be wrong about this, but eh).

IIRC Defiance increases maximum HP and incoming healing. Defensively it's not nearly as good as Shield Oath, although extra HP isn't bad.

[Thunda_Cat_SMASH]

IIRC Defiance increases maximum HP and incoming healing. Defensively it's not nearly as good as Shield Oath, although extra HP isn't bad.

In some ways it's as good/better than Shield Oath, in others it's lacking. A WAR Defiance with rotating CDs will not only have increased maximum HP and spell healing, but a WAR will literally never not have some kind of defensive buff in Defiance, ever, whether it's IB or anyone of their massive cool down suite, which doesn't even touch on their self healing(Chaining IB and their cooldowns gives them effectively better defense than anything a PLD could achieve for sustained mitigation)). ShO only really beats out Def when played with a SCH since most of their heals aren't spells, but abilities. Conversely, in certain situations SwO is a greater dps boost then Deliv, but they both have strengths and weaknesses. (SwO around 15% increased DPS through AAs alone before factoring in the lack of damage penalty, while Deliv is the clear winner in AoE damage.

I might enjoy tanking a bit, so I kiiinda thoroughly studied both jobs.

[DacienSanderon]

In some ways it's as good/better than Shield Oath, in others it's lacking. A WAR Defiance with rotating CDs will not only have increased maximum HP and spell healing, but a WAR will literally never not have some kind of defensive buff in Defiance, ever, whether it's IB or anyone of their massive cool down suite, which doesn't even touch on their self healing(Chaining IB and their cooldowns gives them effectively better defense than anything a PLD could achieve for sustained mitigation)).

I might enjoy tanking a bit, so I kiiinda thoroughly studied both jobs.

You don't know what literally or ever mean. IB has less than 50% uptime, not to mention it is not used in AE pulls. Meanwhile paladins get their 4% block bonus mitigation and 5% flash mitigation. The stances themselves are basically identical though.

[DacienSanderon]

Assuming I ever have the wrath to use it. I largely burn it ASAP on SC on big pulls, especially when zerked.

So you time turning on defiance to land right as the healer gets his heal off? Amazing skills that! What if the healer casts regen or uses an instant heal. Perhaps you time the stance switches between regen ticks and have professor x mind reading skills too.

[Thunda_Cat_SMASH]

So you time turning on defiance to land right as the healer gets his heal off? Amazing skills that! What if the healer casts regen or uses an instant heal. Perhaps you time the stance switches between regen ticks and have professor x mind reading skills too.

Couldn't say, personally. Steel Cyclone is the strongest AoE damage WAR has, however, so I have no problems burning it for damage if the healer is half decent. Conversely, if the healer is lacking, I'll find myself prioritizing it's use for sustain rather than DPS. As for Regen? So long as it lands on me before I swap onto Deliv, I'll have the boosted ticks on me for as long as it lasts. Incidentally, Defiance doesn't do anything for non Aspect Benefic instant heals, as Defiance doesn't buff healing abilities, just spells. Logically speaking, this means as far as Tetra/Lustrate/ED are concerned, I might as well be in Deliverance for all the good they'll do me.

The joys of having an oGCD stance swap~

Snip.

Regarding CD suites, WAR can chain mitigation back to back to back for a full 91-119 seconds on an AoE pull at minimum, with three infuriates, 3 1,200 potency heals, 1 RI+Aw combo, 1 conv+ToB, 1 Ven, 2 Rampart, 1 Holmgang, and 4 IBs. Of course, this is ridiculously inefficient DPS wise because SC is a free 200 potency AoE around the WAR that ignores the defiance penalty with no drop off in enmity generated. A WAR in DPS stance can chain together back to back CDs for roughly the same time as PLD at 55 seconds, but unlike PLD WAR has a semi spammable 300 potency AoE in Decimate which they can pull off three times back to back to back. Add Berserk, that hits even harder at nearly 400 potency with a +10% chance to crits on every mob pulled.

[MoroMurasaki]

I'm generally in the middle here, I like a medium pull (especially on WHM) but when they get past 2 packs many DF tanks need a pretty constant heal spam to not be floortanking in seconds.

That being said I just did Xephatol as AST with a BRD, MCH and the best PLD I have ever seen. He did every pull as large as possible amd even with that I was spamming Gravity and melting everything like I was a DPS. My Aspected Benefic shields were lasting crazy lengths of time. It got to a point that he would just throw a Clemency on himself every once in a while and I just killed things.

On bosses he was the perfect Sword Oath PLD, I am on PS4 so I can't run a parser but from what I could tell he was doing good damage.

Just so stress free, so unlike what I expected when he first pulled all the way up the hill

Point is? Some tanks can handle it. Sadly more tanks just think they can handle it.

[Trespar]

There's this ridiculous idea that it's faster to do big pulls with every party composition.

But I find it hard to believe that a party with two dps that come with low aoe capabilities clears faster with big pulls but no healer dps, than small pulls with healer dps.
I often find myself in a situation where I can't dps because I have to spamheal, and the pull actually takes forever to clear, sometimes to the point where I almost run out of MP just from spamming heals.

On the other hand, smaller pulls allow me to keep the tank up with HoTs and ogcds and I get to spam my broken aoe spell and everything just melts.

Small pulls are okay. I actually enjoy them far more. Just spamming Benefic II just to keep the tank alive is actually not fun for me. I'd like to use all my abilities.
It's also great if I get some time to manage my cards so I have at least one Balance combo for the boss.

Tanks really need to learn their and the party's limits.
And realize that it's okay to pull smaller packs sometimes.

[MoroMurasaki]

There's this ridiculous idea that it's faster to do big pulls with every party composition.

But I find it hard to believe that a party with two dps that come with low aoe capabilities clears faster with big pulls but no healer dps, than small pulls with healer dps.
I often find myself in a situation where I can't dps because I have to spamheal, and the pull actually takes forever to clear, sometimes to the point where I almost run out of MP just from spamming heals.

On the other hand, smaller pulls allow me to keep the tank up with HoTs and ogcds and I get to spam my broken aoe spell and everything just melts.

Small pulls are okay. I actually enjoy them far more. Just spamming Benefic II just to keep the tank alive is actually not fun for me. I'd like to use all my abilities.
It's also great if I get some time to manage my cards so I have at least one Balance combo for the boss.

Tanks really need to learn their and the party's limits.
And realize that it's okay to pull smaller packs sometimes.

I agree with this 100%, I just personally feel like on a 2 pack pull I can still DPS (in general, obviously not always the case based on the mobs/my level) and it goes faster than single pulls. Again, generalization.

I also think party composition should play a huge role here. When you have double monk maybe don't run from boss to boss.

Sadly these things are too nuanced for a lot of DF tanks apparently.

Also I didn't want to bring up the ability to DPS more because with the people who I've seen in this thread I don't want it to get derailed into another healer DPS debate.

[Ftail]

And to make matters worse, thanks to sprint not burning all your TP anymore, tanks now think it's somehow okay to sprint away from the healer...

As a Scholar, I've been really struggling not during big pulls, but whenever the tank decides it's a good idea to use the sprint button. Sure, I always use my sprint button to chase after them when they decide to do that, but for some reason my fairy is literally unable to keep up with me sprinting.

After surviving a large pull with EOS lagging far behind, I sometimes get tanks that think it's a good idea to use the sprint button after every fight. Usually the tank starts running to the next group before all the mobs are fully dead. I just blew all my cool-downs for that mega pull and I literally only needed like 5-6 more seconds for my Aetherflow stacks to be back up before the next large pull. It's annoying having tanks die because your cooldowns are literally seconds from refreshing.