Take it easy, Tanks.

[Spiriel_Basanda]

They are not, however, fun because of the playerbase whining at us. I enjoy tanking. I enjoy my job's abilities and buttons. I enjoy the role itself and what it entails. I don't, however, enjoy people complaining when my pacing isn't to their liking.

I always have fun while I am tanking but it just takes one person to whine and complain about if I pull to much or pull to little even if it is just the first pull and I am trying to get a feel for the healer and dps. Then come to the forums and complain about it. Even when I am doing my job right by holding threat and not taking to much damage I still get people complaining I am not in my tank stance.

This is why I don't say a thing outside of actual conversation or telling new people boss mechanics when I'm in a group while I'm playing a DD job. I've healed, I've tanked(in WoW at least, trying to level a tank in this, though I'm admittedly a little bit.....let's say worried about getting the "Going to slow!" thing as a tank while I'm learning how to do the role in this), and I know it's rough.

There's no reason to hassle the people that are willing to do the jobs most of the people playing an MMO don't want to do, if you were to ask me. As long as we aren't wiping over and over, you do you, it doesn't bother me. <3 to the healers and the tanks.

[MoroMurasaki]

Amusingly, I'd never say anything in that case. You're comfortable single pulling? Cool. It pretty much guarantees a smooth run and I'm going to blast the hell out of stuff.

It's when people big pull while in Shire gear in Doma Castle and I can't do anything except use every GCD on Cure 2 without them dying that I get frustrated.

You seem to always have such quotable, likable posts. This is (again) very much the exact way I feel, I'm almost compelled to change my signature...

[Tridus]

You seem to always have such quotable, likable posts. This is (again) very much the exact way I feel, I'm almost compelled to change my signature...

<3 Thanks!

[Maeka]

Amusingly, I'd never say anything in that case. You're comfortable single pulling? Cool. It pretty much guarantees a smooth run and I'm going to blast the hell out of stuff.

It's when people big pull while in Shire gear in Doma Castle and I can't do anything except use every GCD on Cure 2 without them dying that I get frustrated.

This is exactly how I feel too. Single pulls, I can throw lots of DPS spells, and my play experience is more enjoyable.

However, I have had *good* tanks multipulling.. still mildly stressful but nowhere near as bad as undergeared people doing it. I met this 49k Paladin today... Kugane Castle. He multi-pulled every multi-pull possible in the zone, but he used his cooldowns, and all that jazz. It was somewhat hectic, but comfortable still. We also had a pair of rather good DPS who were actually capable of killing the junk in some reasonable time-frame. I was able to squeek out a few Aero 3s, even a Stone IV now and then, though admittedly I was more focused on healing the tank, almost lost him once but nobody died. It was a good run.

But for every run like that, there's 10 where I am doing nothing but Cure2 and/or Tetra/Assize/Lucid the whole dungeon and those are just not fun for the healer. Yeah, sure the tank and DPS are having a ball blowing stuff up but the healer? It isn't fun whatsoever. I have more than 4 buttons. I would appreciate the chance to use them, kthx.

[Jas710]

As a Scholar, I've been really struggling not during big pulls, but whenever the tank decides it's a good idea to use the sprint button. Sure, I always use my sprint button to chase after them when they decide to do that, but for some reason my fairy is literally unable to keep up with me sprinting.

After surviving a large pull with EOS lagging far behind, I sometimes get tanks that think it's a good idea to use the sprint button after every fight. Usually the tank starts running to the next group before all the mobs are fully dead. I just blew all my cool-downs for that mega pull and I literally only needed like 5-6 more seconds for my Aetherflow stacks to be back up before the next large pull. It's annoying having tanks die because your cooldowns are literally seconds from refreshing.

In this scenario, let them fucking die to teach them a lesson. You adapting only sends them the message that their behavior is okay.

[Jas710]

They are plenty fun because of job design.

They are not, however, fun because of the playerbase whining at us. I enjoy tanking. I enjoy my job's abilities and buttons. I enjoy the role itself and what it entails. I don't, however, enjoy people complaining when my pacing isn't to their liking.

I thoroughly enjoy myself when my group lets me do what I wanna do.

I think you might have misunderstood my phrasing. I am in complete agreement with you.

[Maeka]

I think you might have misunderstood my phrasing. I am in complete agreement with you.

OH! You said "They aren't fun because of the job design"... I think you meant "They aren't fun, not because of the job design, but..."

*grins* I see what happened now.

[Fealow]

Had some more time mull this over and im generally of the opinion that Tanks should at least communicate their intention, but I'm not really getting behind this whole bad tanks not mitigating enough etc...

Every healer has access to what I call predictive healing spells and some kind of regen (healbot in SCH case) Example of predictive healing spell:

AST - Earthly star

I honestly don't see how we healers can't keep a bad tank alive if we plan ahead using such abilities. A largesse regen when the tank has finished the pull will keep them reasonably healthy for the majority of it's duration and using one of the predictive healing spells after you apply said regen will normally involve the spell being ready to do it's thing as the regen is finishing it's countdown. If that is not enough then you always have your oGCD heal to fall back on. I've done plenty of runs myself where I've only ever used regens and my oGCD heal to get us through it.

Continued in next post...

[Tridus]

Had some more time mull this over and im generally of the opinion that Tanks should at least communicate their intention, but I'm not really getting behind this whole bad tanks not mitigating enough etc...

Every healer has access to what I call predictive healing spells and some kind of regen (healbot in SCH case) Example of predictive healing spell:

AST - Earthly star

I honestly don't see how we healers can't keep a bad tank alive if we plan ahead using such abilities. A largesse regen when the tank has finished the pull will keep them reasonably healthy for the majority of it's duration and using one of the predictive healing spells after you apply said regen will normally involve the spell being ready to do it's thing as the regen is finishing it's countdown. If that is not enough then you always have your oGCD heal to fall back on. I've done plenty of runs myself where I've only ever used regens and my oGCD heal to get us through it.

Here's a trick for you - the post length limit only applies to original posts. You can edit a post to make it as long as you want.


Anyway... Last night I had a tank in Sohm Al who sprinted away when I started casting Protect and grabbed 3 packs of stuff on the way. By time I caught him (because my sprint can't close the gap with him also sprinting), he was at 10% health. Regen isn't gonna get it done at that point. Hell, Cure 2 isn't gonna get it done at that point, since he'll be long dead by time it goes off. So hey, Benediction it is! Course, then the DPS started taking damage (because of all the poison flying around when you combine those packs), and if I stop tank healing long enough to help the DPS, the tank dies. That's exactly what happened.


There's no preparing for that, except maybe a macro on Protect saying "I'm casting Protect, don't run away."

I also think you grossly underestimate the variance in squishiness between tanks. I've gotten the same class in the same dungeon and it's night and day. One guy can be healed by Regen with an occasional other spell, and the other one requires my full attention. I've never played a MMO with wider variances in just how difficult tanks are to keep alive. Like, this:

Largesse > regen > Earthly star on tank > Collective unconscious on tank > observe tank health for next 15 seconds > respond accordingly with oGCD heal or using stellar detonation

Lovely advice, when you don't get some guy who thinks Sword Oath is just as good for tanking 9 things as Shield Oath. When you get that guy, you've got about 4 seconds before you're the new tank. Those are the ones that bug me. If I can't reapply Regen because the tank is taking so much damage that the GCD not providing immediate healing is going to result in death, the tank pulling too much stuff for their gear/skill. That's just a raw "HPS keep up with incoming DPS" race. I mean, I've done plenty of dungeons where I only needed Regen and oGCD stuff too. Those ones are AWESOME. It's the ones where that results in a swift and terrible death that we're talking about.

[Maeka]

Lovely advice, when you don't get some guy who thinks Sword Oath is just as good for tanking 9 things as Shield Oath. When you get that guy, you've got about 4 seconds before you're the new tank.

Remember the old days when you'd go into, say, <Lv30 dungeons like Copperbell, or even Toto-Rak and if you had a horrible tank that refused to use Flash, you'd tank stuff yourself and just not care, as you could tank better than the actual tank could anyways? lol

A part of me misses those days. I used to tank Graffias (last boss of Toto-Rak) and all of his adds and walk away with 3/3 commendations more often than a WHM should lol.