Thank you SE

[Thoro39]

DRK+PLD was disadvantageous in HW for many reasons:

1) WAR was the only class who wanted to apply the slashing debuff without offing themselves
2) HW DRK wanted to take damage and tank the boss due to Bloodprice and Lowblow+Reprisal Procs, while doing as few powerslashes as possible
3) HW PLD naturally took aggro off HW DRK due Royal Authority combo'ing off Savage Blade, making DRK+PLD comps obviously a pain for the DRK to optimize
4) STR debuff/INT debuff from PLD/DRK weren't as good as WAR's Storm's Path

What changed in SB?
Point 1 is moot, since Ninja and Samurai readily and happily apply slashing now.
Point 2? Bloodprice got heavily nerfed and Reprisal/Lowblow procs got removed entirely.
Point 3? No longer an issue since Royal Authority now combo's off Riot Blade, as well as the inclusion of shirk support.
Point 4? All moot as well, since all debuffs got removed and thus the competition field got evened out between the tanks.

So yeah, I'd say PLD+DRK is definitely more viable/competitive now in SB than it was back in Heavensward

[eagledorf]

Yeah people should lose their jobs, because of fucking tank balance. This fucking community man. I get that you were probably being somewhat facetious, but even still.

Actually, I'm quite serious.

I mean, if you have somebody working under you that makes the exact same mistake over and over again and you don't remove them from that job, then honestly it's your failure, not theirs. They're just trying their best to do the job that you're assigned to them and they don't get to tell you you're doing a bad job by assigning them that task because you're the boss.

If WAR is a lock again, that means they've made the exact same mistake 6 times in a row including after a very expensive major rework; leaving them to that task expecting them to get it right the 7th time is a monumental failure of management. In fact, it's delusion. Not only will they not get it right, they're guaranteed to just get it wrong exactly the same way again. The only reasonable decision is to reallocate your resources and remove those people from a task they're just incapable of and put them to a task they are able to do and bring in somebody else to do the first task who is capable of it. That's how you manage human resources, it's no different for your stockholders from making sure you budget for enough electricity to keep the servers running.

FWIW actually firing people is quite rare in Japanese culture. Toyota is a great example of this management culture, they hold on to employees even when they can't really afford them and will even pay for random retraining. It works out for Toyota too because their employees are less inclined to unionize. Usually people are simply reassigned. If somebody is truly incapable they're "reassigned" to just sit there and not get in anybody's way, but that would be if they've already failed at everything else. I would hope that SE isn't assigning the people who have already failed at everything else to tank balance after 2 years of promising us they'd get it right in SB!

Again though, wait for Tuesday. For all we know they've done a perfect job. When they discarded tank balance for an entire expansion with promises that it would be fixed in this one, they sure better have.

[Clover210]

This is nearly what I'm talking about. PLDs taking the rejoice for a step towards balance as a personal attack on themselves. PLD severely outclassed the other two tanks, that is fact and SE has acknowledged it. While nerf is simply one way of approaching balance, whether it gets nerfed or DRK/WAR get buffed to hell, it's the same difference.

I've been tanking in this game since 1.2 and following news and the communities closely ever since. I've seen plenty WARs say dumb things like "I'M GONNA MAN-MODE EVERYTHING", getting off on the fact that they were buffed to hell in HW. However, it's been usually humorous, and I have never seen the kind of self-righteous revel in being OP from any but those PLDs.

You're missing the point entirely in what I said earlier in the post. But hey, if you want to paint a strawman for all PLDs who don't like the nerf that's on you for proving my point

[DWolfwood]

You're missing the point entirely in what I said earlier in the post. But hey, if you want to paint a strawman for all PLDs who don't like the nerf that's on you for proving my point

I think your point is pretty clear. Some of us just think being upset over a small DPS nerf on PLD is ludicrous considering we just want the tanks to be balanced.

Being upset as in, "Boooo... oh well" is one thing, but the extent that PLDs are acting like its the end of the world for them is a serious slap in the face to the other tanks. By all means keep believing whatever you want though.

[LadyCeles]

PLD will be pushed out the meta again. WAR and DRK will have faster def CDs making them better MTs and have higher DPS making them better OTs too. PLDs utility is nice but dps is the meta and PLD utility lowers there DPS further

[Makeda]

Way r u talking about? Check fflogs pld is slamming war and drk by 3 and 400 dps respectfully

So...

https://kichwas.tumblr.com/post/163047613524/ffxiv
https://www.fflogs.com/statistics/15...nks&dataset=70



Paladin is how much higher than the other tanks again?

Yes this is 70th percentile.

If you go to 100% percentile... thereby adding in the 30% of LEAST SKILLED players... Paladin rises to the top, but only by a thin hair line.

The lower the percentile you go into, the more skilled the player base, the more Paladin falls in the ranking.

This is with current extreme trials only, as flogs doesn't yet have anything from Omega or light party dungeons on the statistics pages.

[BluexBird]

PLD will be pushed out the meta again.

Out the meta? What is this "meta" you are speaking of? Let me take a guess:

"Oh, one class does 3200 DPS, but this one does 3100. So, therefore, uh, uhm... ehhh... yeah, the one that does 3100 DPS is UNPLAYABLE! And so, I will never accept them into any of my parties".

If that is the meta you follow, then I feel extremely sorry for you and all the others who think that way. Seriously, get a grip on yourselves. -_-

Now currently, before nerfs, that is the situation we have. Paladins are doing a couple of hundred DPS over Warriors. However, all Warriors can do in a party is deal damage. If Warriors had the kind of utility that Paladins have, they wouldn't be complaining about the fact that they aren't the #1 DPS. But they have nothing else going for them. Paladins, on the other hand, can do a whole lot of things apart from just dealing damage. And still they complain about the prospect of losing a spot that never had in sense in being theirs.

[BluexBird]

So...

Paladin is how much higher than the other tanks again?

Uh, I dunno. Why don't you try checking MEANINGFUL STATISTICS:



And that Warrior on #3 probably got massive aid from its party members.

[Makeda]

Uh, I dunno. Why don't you try checking MEANINGFUL STATISTICS:



And that Warrior on #3 probably got massive aid from its party members.

So you have stats from only 10 individual players for each boss, and you call that meaningful?

I have stats for the top 70% of ALL fflogs players, for those two bosses. I think my stats have a LOT more tracking to them...

I also noticed you failed to provide a link to your stats page for anyone to check them with.

[SyzzleSpark]

So...

https://kichwas.tumblr.com/post/163047613524/ffxiv
https://www.fflogs.com/statistics/15...nks&dataset=70



Paladin is how much higher than the other tanks again?

Yes this is 70th percentile.

If you go to 100% percentile... thereby adding in the 30% of LEAST SKILLED players... Paladin rises to the top, but only by a thin hair line.

The lower the percentile you go into, the more skilled the player base, the more Paladin falls in the ranking.

This is with current extreme trials only, as flogs doesn't yet have anything from Omega or light party dungeons on the statistics pages.

You have it backwards and apparently can't properly read FFlogs. Higher percentile = more skilled players, not less skilled.