The Raid community as we know it

[Kyt]

being aggressive, yelling at people, this does not make anyone play better nor will they learn. I'm a teacher by trade. This sort of "methodology" only pushes learners away.

Teaching kids in a classroom and leading a high-pressure savage raid are two very different things. Xeno himself says that HE even plays better when people call him out when he screws up. That's proof right there that your ideas on teaching are invalid across mediums that aren't classroom-based. The atmosphere that severely harsh raid leaders create is one filled with pressure and anxiety only if you're just not good enough to play at that level. If you are the epitome of perfect in your class, you don't have to worry about being yelled at because you'll never screw up anyway. If you get yelled at constantly cause you're screwing up constantly, then not only are you in the wrong raid group, but you're probably doing content that's too hard for you in the first place.

[SlogDog]

Yeah, there was a reddit thread created by someone in one of the Discord servers I'm in. While I don't necessarily agree with the way he went about it, I think I sort of agree with his point, which someone else nicely stated in a comment reply.



https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...ull_of_myself/

This is a response to that. And I sort of agree with him. Especially with Omega recently, there are sometimes mechanics that stack on top of each other so playing reactively isn't the best. I'd say the main thing I'm upset is that this advice may be followed by newer players who don't know any better.



Yep.

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...being/dg7jnbe/

I'm not going to get into the debate about DPS but their prediction for SB made me sad. I get my heart smashed constantly... I mean I gave up a fun aspect of my job, one i enjoyed, so that other healers would be more comfortable... but i still see sub 100 dps healers. I still see people defending them. I still see healers giving horrible advice trying to deflect their own shortcomings including "there is so much variety in heal styles!".

I agree with the thread and its sad to see people defending them. Like I said they can be horrible and fluff around all day- I don't have to deal with them, but soon as you give advice we have an issue.

ah ok ..if thats the case he wont get a whole lot of dps since I heal in raids with the occasional dps here and there

Classic.

[YitharV2]

I'm not going to get into the debate about DPS but their prediction for SB made me sad. I get my heart smashed constantly... I mean I gave up a fun aspect of my job, one i enjoyed, so that other healers would be more comfortable... but i still see sub 100 dps healers. I still see people defending them. I still see healers giving horrible advice trying to deflect their own shortcomings including "there is so much variety in heal styles!".

I agree with the thread and its sad to see people defending them. Like I said they can be horrible and fluff around all day- I don't have to deal with them, but soon as you give advice we have an issue.

I agree. I was doing Omega yesterday and in v3 there was a mentor healer just idling when there was no healing needed. It made me really sad.

Yeah, if she wants to do that with her group, that's fine. I don't have to play with her. But the fact that she's giving bad advice to new players is the problem I have.

[ToasterMan]

I'm sure they appreciate the free advertising lol

There are certainly situations where if you want to make progress you have to speak up about what needs to be improved. I personally am overly critical of myself, if I screw something up everyone will know by the obscenities coming across their speakers lol. But a lot of times people simply don't realize they are messing up or that they could be doing such and such better, or they simply play it off hoping no one will notice. So you're only hurting yourself, and the group, if those kind of things aren't discussed. It doesn't have to be hateful or callous, and most of the time it's not. I would say, however, the closer you are as friends outside of raid, the higher your tolerance for trash talk will be.

That's why hardcore raiding would never work for me. I have anxiety issues and if people start to focus on me that only increases my chance of failing more. I'd imagine that would be true for a lot more people.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

There would be no problem with that if the hardcore raiders weren't spreading their toxic playstyle to the rest of the game and actively causing or encouraging people to quit the game so they can raid more "without those casuals causing a wipe"

If a raid group kicks a player for any reason not direct attributed to making the game unbearable, that is griefing.

People need to have a mind of their own. Just because Xeno, MrHappy or anyone else says something doesn't mean everyone should necessarily take it as the gospel nor are they responsible for those who do. They aren't encouraging anything. If you dislike their respective styles or the audience who is drawn towards it, don't participate.

No, it isn't. Putting aside we have GMs specifically quoted claiming kicks are justifiable for any reason. If I put up a Party Finder, I am free to restrict it however I please. That includes excluding people who don't meld, use food, DPS on healer or wear Fending gear. I could do something stupid like demand meta groups for Shinryu. If these perimeters aren't to your fancy, you are free to leave. You cannot, however, force me to accept you won't meld. The only thing we can't outright do is post parse numbers to shame other players publicly. Anything else is entirely fair game. Don't like, leave the parties who enforce it.

That's not excusable. Nobody is asking for everyone to be a sweet cupcake, because sometimes you do need someone to be "Dr.House" and give it to you straight, but the entire point of "Dr.House" was that he lacked bedside manner or tact, because he only took cases that were challenging. He absolutely did everything possible to avoid doing anything easy. If your patient thinks the pills you prescribe them make their pee smell funny so they stopped taking them, you want the doctor to say "You will ****ing die if you don't take those pills. That is on YOU, not ME."

Hence in a raid, if there is a wipe, identify the problem, not WHO cause the problem. Not enough DPS, ask who can do better. Can't heal through damage, ask if anyone can switch with the healer. Tank is instant-killed on a certain mechanic, switch tanks, etc. If someone you play with simply can't play any role, as apparent by always taking dirt naps as DPS, then perhaps that person needs to try a different DPS. You get absolutely nowhere by kicking people because they aren't the top 1% DPS on a third party unverifiable website.

They don't do that. They are simply brutally honest-- think along the lines of "Well that was fucking retarded. How about not standing next to the tank like a dumbass?" Aggressive, yes, but that's the style they happen to like. If you don't, stay out of their parties. And it isn't like Xeno suddenly goes off on a verbal beat down for every little mistake. I've been in his parties before. The only time he starts getting pissed is when people continuously make the same dumb mistakes, especially if they refuse to own up to them. He's far more tolerant in learning parties, for instance. Hell, he's stayed with people for hours just to help them clear. It's the people he feels has wasted his time or have no interest in self improvement where his patience wanes.

People are not obligated to coddle nor make you feel good. There is a reason every video game with an online component specifically mentions "online experience may change." And before you go on about griefing. GMs will not do anything should someone call you names over discord. They only care if it happens directly in-game.

[akaneakki]

PThey only care if it happens directly in-game.

I know tons of people who play with xeno and he can be blunt but such a great guy. The fact he helps a lot of players, guides to savage raids, tank perspective etc and so on. I would also get mad if someone makes mistake plenty of times when they shouldn't. The sad part is the same excuse always comes ''as long the duty is done doesn't matter how long it takes'' Or ''its just a game we all play for fun'' FF14 is highly pointed as a big pve game with good story, and pve means shit has to die simple as that. Many often think it's funny for the other people in group to wipe all over again and again.

To make it simple when you are good at something, you want to get in and out fast, not screwing around thinking its okay.

[Yeol]

I saw the broadcast, you need to understand that he is taking raiding seriously. He stated many, many times that his response is towards serious endgame raiding, not casual content like dungeons and story trials. Even when talking about raiding, it is for those who take it hardcore. Cus' raiding can be casual.

He also stated that he will point out when people screw their rotations or make a mistake, INCLUDING himself. And his group can do the same to him. I see nothing wrong with that.

If anything, many people look up to be as good as him. He writes guides and gives back to the community. As a person, he is not bad at all. He doesn't mean to harm you in any way.

I bet many of you say bad stuff about people in PF/DF (we have a popular thread about this). Even if you don't type it in party chat. But you do say nasty stuff about the bad players you run into. How is he any different?

[akaneakki]

To all complainers in here, what have you contributed as a person/player to the community? Any guides? Anything on rotations? I would like to see that, since they love to badmouth someone they don't even know, in fact bad mouth someone who actually helps people. Please give us some content you worked on. I know I wont see any and we all know why :')

[Annah]

To all complainers in here, what have you contributed as a person/player to the community? Any guides? Anything on rotations? I would like to see that, since they love to badmouth someone they don't even know, in fact bad mouth someone who actually helps people. Please give us some content you worked on. I know I wont see any and we all know why :')

If I draw a diagram or had a twitch channel then that makes it ok for me to be rude to others

Edited my last response: I will admit it was too crass

*gets drawing schematics and rotation formulas right away while i licensed a twitch channel

[Kling-Klang]

cool!

So if i draw a diagram for you, then that means I can belittle people in my party?

Did not know that!


*gets drawing schematics and rotation formulas right away while i licensed a twitch channel

Players with a mindset like you are worse than any "elitist".