Consolidated White Mage 4.0 Feedback Thread

[Reiryuu]

So basically, you want the class balance to remain the way it is, with WHM being devoutly ignored in favor of their SCH/AST brethren because WHM's have a weak enough identity as it is. The only unique utility they could potentially give WHM would be more defensive utility, since the opposite would just be a carbon copy of SCH and AST...

That's not entirely true. The idea is similar but different right? Take the ability Dia.

In FFXI Dia was a DoT that lowered enemy armor making it easier to hit and do damage to them. FFXIV does not really have this per se and I'm not really sure how armor affects damage in FFXIV, but just for an example and pulling numbers out of my ass here:

What if Dia was given to WHM and it did a bit of Damage over Time + a very slight debuff on the mob making it take more damage from physical attacks. We're not talking balance levels. Because Dia could constantly be kept up, it would have to be very small (<5%?), but large enough to eventually catch up to a number equivalent to balance over time when the AST can't draw them. This makes an AST who is lucky enough to draw lots of balances far superior, but it gives the whm something to offer that's consistent and reliable. Again, I don't know what the sweet spot would be for an ability like this number wise, but hopefully that makes the point of the idea made.

Perhaps you could have a similar ability that raised magical defense that overwrote Dia (and vice versa so only one could be up at a time) as well.... though I suspect the Scholar's new Libra ability might do this... anyway, that way you're still not really stepping on AST feet since AST balance affects both melee DPS and magical DPS simultaneously.

[Thunda_Cat_SMASH]

What if Dia was given to WHM and it did a bit of Damage over Time + a very slight debuff on the mob making it take more damage from physical attacks.

Oooh, that's a thought! I'm sure that'll-

Wait, MCH already has something exactly like that in Hyper charge. There's also Trick Attack, And if we wanna get really technical, Storm's Eye, Disembowel, Dragon Kick...

So the implication is that they should give WHM a damage spell that causes them to take more damage right? Regardless of whether it's a DoT or not, it's still pretty much ripping off all of the above abilities in what it effectively does, making it once again a carbon copy, only this time it's copying every other role except healers!

Well, all people care about is dps, not support, so I guess such an example is natural...

Thinking about it logically, that utility would most directly mirror TA and Hyper charge, which cause the target to take 10/5% more damage for 10/22-25s every 60/120/s respectively. Assuming they went with that idea and looking at its counterparts, considering that it would be a permanent debuff in essence it would most likely increase damage taken by... .5-1%? 1.5% if we get really, really generous? That sounds like do much fun!

[Reiryuu]

Oooh, that's a thought! I'm sure that'll-

Wait, MCH already has something exactly like that in Hyper charge. There's also Trick Attack, And if we wanna get really technical, Storm's Eye, Disembowel, Dragon Kick...

So the implication is that they should give WHM a damage spell that causes them to take more damage right? Regardless of whether it's a DoT or not, it's still pretty much ripping off all of the above abilities in what it effectively does, making it once again a carbon copy, only this time it's copying every other role except healers!

Well, all people care about is dps, not support, so I guess such an example is natural...

Well, your argument was a defensive ability. I only wanted to counter with an example for one that was more offensive in nature. But I agree with you that the meta is so blind to anything that's not +DPS that anything else would be largely ignored. =/ Maybe a white wind ability that's a very slow regen + slight haste? *shrug*

[Thunda_Cat_SMASH]

=/ Maybe a white wind ability that's a very slow regen + slight haste? *shrug*

Well, now you're just flat out copying SCH's Fey Wind. Pretty much every type of offensive buff has already been covered by one of the other classes, so there really isn't anything they can give WHM that wouldn't be straight copying from someone else. As it is now, unless SE does something to shake up the healer meta, they'll be playing pretty much exactly the same way they have been for the last four years.

And thus, with the dps obsession, the meta stagnates further.

[Reiryuu]

*snip*

And you're being a little overobsessed with copying. Is the Arrow card with Expanded also a copy of Fey Wind? The numbers don't have to be the same. The random idea (which admittely was off the top of the head) was just something of a very slow, long lasting regen with a small haste component. You don't have to be so on edge accusing every suggestion of a blatant copy.

There's only so many ways one can play to the meta without turning it upside down and that is something I doubt SE will be able to do with the way they have set things up and design things.