Why are summoners so neglected?

[Silverquick]

The issue is that this game has become all about balance, and the point we're making about it being just new animations/egi's is that, similarly to any other dps job, you have little difference between each of their max dps so if everyone is doing 50 50 50 50 50, then what's the difference in just feeding the beast (smn playerbase

I would be happy sacrificing new gear for SMN if they gave us more summons.

I wouldn't... I only make use of Titan and Garuda at this point anyway.

I'm already running a rotation that looks like this...

Single Target:
Quick Cast + Shadowflare>Bio 2>Miasma>Bio>(Garuda) Contagion>Fester>Ruin 3>Ruin 3>Fester>Rouse + Spur + Enkindle (Aerial Blast)>Ruin 3>Fester>Dreadwyrm Trance>Ruin 3 (x4)>Tri-Disaster>Deathflare (aka TeraFlare).

Thats not even including Raise during Raids, or Double tapping a Ruin 3 + Ruin 2 for a Dual cast quick 280 potency Burst.

Or on Multiple Targets.
Quick Cast + Shadowflare>Tri-Disaster>Garuda (Contagion)>Painflare>Bane>Rouse + Spur + Enkindle (Aerial Blast)>Painflare>Dreadwyrm Trance>Bliz 2 (x3)>Deathflare (aka TeraFlare).

I don't NEED another pet... I've already got a ton of abilities... and ALL of them get used. Well Admittedly I don't get much use out of Ifrit these days... only Titan and Garuda.

Its why I keep wondering if you guys have played this class or not to any respectable level.

Do you have any idea how many abilities this job ALREADY has? I already run 3 Bars worth of abilities on any given dungeon or raid... and I use ALL of them... NONE of my powers or abilities as a Summoner are not used with the exception of Tri-Bind and Virus... and Virus is actually useful... its just irrelevent at my level... (and so is Physic because is too low powered)

[azura84]

snip..

First of all, I can respect a good rotation and player taking the time to delve into the details, you're not alone in this. What "I" am proposing is simply giving us more summons and then grouping their 5 main abilities under a single action button, like have all the summons 1st abilities (Wind Blade, Rock Blaster, Crimson Cyclone) fit under a single action button since you can only have 1 out at a time, each of those buttons having the list of actions they perform in their description, thus reducing the number of hotbars required (except if you like having a CD list on your screen) and also giving us more summons. You're looking at this from a statistical perspective and we're looking at this from a more lore based perspective, since traditionally more and more summons are made as you progress with summoners in final fantasy games (all of them). We have just 3 and all are little unintimidating baby egi's, it's just kinda like a fart in the wind compared to what summons have always been, big and imposing.

[Silverquick]

First of all, I can respect a good rotation and player taking the time to delve into the details, you're not alone in this. What "I" am proposing is simply giving us more summons and then grouping their 5 main abilities under a single action button. You're looking at this from a statistical perspective and we're looking at this from a more lore based perspective, since traditionally more and more summons are made as you progress with summoners in final fantasy games (all of them). We have just 3 and all are little unintimidating baby egi's, it's just kinda like a fart in the wind compared to what summons have always been, big and imposing.

BUT... do they get used.... or are they just for coolness purposes...

Grouping the abilities is cool and all but its not going to change anything in the end.

The reason Ifrit doesn't get used anymore has nothing to do with how good he actually is. His Inferno attack is actually slightly better than Garuda's Aerial Blast when you use Enkindle... and its got a DoT tacked on... but Garuda has Contagion too, which is critical to extending your DoTs, and its more valuable in the end than either Ifrits Fireshield or his Inferno.

So... Garuda is the one that gets used, plus its a distance attacker that you can shift targets to instantly rather than Ifrit having to move all the way over to attack something.

How exactly is this going to change if you add another Summon? Even if you did group the abilities like you are talking about... it doesn't change the base reality that only one of them gets used anyway.

[Kazrah]

First of all, I can respect a good rotation and player taking the time to delve into the details, you're not alone in this. What "I" am proposing is simply giving us more summons and then grouping their 5 main abilities under a single action button, like have all the summons 1st abilities (Wind Blade, Rock Blaster, Crimson Cyclone) fit under a single action button since you can only have 1 out at a time, each of those buttons having the list of actions they perform in their description, thus reducing the number of hotbars required (except if you like having a CD list on your screen) and also giving us more summons. You're looking at this from a statistical perspective and we're looking at this from a more lore based perspective, since traditionally more and more summons are made as you progress with summoners in final fantasy games (all of them).

I'm still not seeing how this is a separate solution from just sticking with egi glamours, because by giving egi glamours, not only would it provide the sense of having those extra summons, but also skip over the petty disputes of what role each one of them would be. Ah yes, pet role, the major reason why there's no need to have more egis.

"How about an AoE-focused egi?": Not only would this be too situational, but if SMN was really that desperate for more AoE damage (like it's actually needed), it'd be easier just to buff the AoE skills of the current egis.
"Why not a CC egi?": Quick, when was the last time you used a CC skill outside of a quest? You're right, never, and that's about how often such an egi would be used.
"What about a debuffing egi?": So debuffs that either wouldn't work on major fights and/or debuffs that other jobs provide? Sure person without friends that could provide them, although balancing it would mean its damage would be worse compared to other egis.
"I want a support egi!": If you want a support pet, stick to SCH. Otherwise, you'd end up with the loser who wants a debuffing egi.
"I'd like an egi with X ability.": If it's off a primal, then that primal could wind up as a glamour and might hopefully have an ability like that one.

Sure, egi glamouring isn't a perfect system, but it's a lot better than asking for more egis when the vast majority of SMN players don't even use all of the ones available to them.