Put back Extreme trial on raid finder again...please

[Mocita]

It could allow us to know before queing if someone is new or not.

Some people have real life stuff to take care of, so chances are they're unable to get on when the patch drops. If anything, you should be happy for new people. Explain the fight to them and just be patient. It's not like everyone else was any better when all of that first dropped. Sure, they had to learn the hard way, and there were no videos to watch. But, isn't our job to help teach other players how things go? As a mentor, I take great pride in helping other players, whether they be new adventurers, returners, or even other mentors themselves. While I'm not much of an Extreme runner or raider myself, I still will teach new people in the duty how to do mechanics.

[Reinha]

the defining difference between Duty Finder and Party Finder

There is no reason it should be either or. Raid Finder was made to be a DF with filtering options and I think it's a bit redundant when those options could just be placed in DF.

Just put the choice of "cleared" / "no preference" in both DF and PF, problem solved. Match those who select "cleared" only with each other and match those with "no preference" with each other in DF. Have the default set to no preference. The people who dislike "no preference" aren't queuing in DF anyway right now so they wouldn't affect those queues should they decide to queue and choose the "cleared" option.

Also add a feature which helps PF leaders distinguish those without a clear before queuing to the duty so it remains an equally viable way to fill a group.

[HyoMinPark]

Snip Snip.

Ex primals are incredibly different from just regular duties. Some that are not even relevant anymore still have mechanics that, if one person messes up, can wipe the entire group (Thordan Ex, Sephirot Ex).

The purpose of individuals making a PF for a farm party is to run the primal as many times as they can, as quickly as possible, with great DPS and limited mistakes. When individuals want to teach, they join Clear/Learning PFs. I've seen it all the time; I do it. But when people want to farm for weapons or for mounts, having a new player sneak into the party is going to prevent them for achieving their goal: to farm.

Ex primals take a while to explain, and usually there have to be multiple wipes for people to finally understand "Oh! That's how you do it!" or "That's what I was doing wrong." Most parties that still attempt to farm after helping a new person clear rarely seem to even get the clear in the first place. Because the new player dies to mechanics a lot, people get impatient, and they drop the group.

They took away the one feature that could guarantee no new players could sneak into farm parties by removing the Ex primals from Raid Finder to Duty Finder. I can't tell you the number of times I had people sneak into parties I joined, and we got nowhere. Then the group dropped, I'm without a single successful run much less a mount, and then I have to start/search for a new farm party.

If they want to move the Ex Primals and Savage into DF that's fine. But please give players the options from Raid Finder: Duty Complete, Duty Incomplete, Practice, etc..

EDIT: People keep saying that everyone's time is equally important, and that players that have cleared content should be considerate and accommodate those that haven't cleared, but it also goes the other way. New players should respect the wishes of a FARM party by not joining in the first place. Farm parties are not the place to get a clear.

People say that farm parties need to make PF because that's what it's there for. Guess what: it's also there for people to make CLEAR and LEARNING parties. It's there for all groups of players to use. DF, RF, or no RF, I would still want the option for Duty Complete or Duty Incomplete. This isn't even something that affects me (I have all the HW mounts), and I'm still for it.

I'm a mentor as well, have been for a while. If I want to teach, or feel like helping players clear content, I look for clear parties and join them, offering and and all advice I can. Some days, I don't want to teach (those days I just turn my crown off). I want to farm. Or get things done. And it's easier to get through content (usually) with those that are proficient in the fight (i.e., have it on farm).

[Dualgunner]

If anything, you should be happy for new people. Explain the fight to them and just be patient. It's not like everyone else was any better when all of that first dropped.

Try number 16 today in the duty finder to get my win and a chance at the bird! Oh good...another new person just like the last fifteen times! 100 bonus lore! I can't wait to waste 90 minutes wiping against the boss because it's not easy to the point of in some fights being impossible to learn on the fly! And then the group either disbands or time runs out and I don't get that 100 lore OR that clear and chance at the bird.

Try number seventeen...

But, isn't our job to help teach other players how things go?

It's a game, not a job or a duty.

As a mentor, I take great pride in helping other players,

I was recently quoted saying that there's a reason not everyone is a mentor: Not everyone wants to teach, and not everyone is particularly good at teaching either. I don't mean to come off as harsh, as I do enjoy helping people learn fights as well, but I personally need to be in the right mood to do it, or I won't teach as effectively. That's one of the reasons my crown is consistently off.

whether they be new adventurers, returners, or even other mentors themselves. While I'm not much of an Extreme runner or raider myself, I still will teach new people in the duty how to do mechanics.

It's a great thing to want to help others. An amazing thing, and the more who want to the better! But that desire shouldn't be projected onto everyone else, nor should the duty be forced onto people.

[Sida]

I'm of the opinion that the mechanical restriction to limit completedness should not exists in DF when random parties is concerned. I'm also of the opinion that there should be option to confirm this state for full party queuing. The RF was an attempt to amend the situation for servers where the PF ran dry. It's not needed anymore now that we have the cross server party finder ability that far surpasses it. The ability to solo queue for farming didn't exist before RF, and it doesn't have to. It is an anomaly that was a byproduct in attempt to help the dry servers. At the same time, for like-minded preformed group, being able to vet out those who have applied falsily should be an option.

In essence. Give option for full parties to see if someone doesn't have the completion before queuing, keep harder content full party queue only (as it used to be), and no such restriction options when queuing in smaller segments.

[Astyrah]

And I'm ignoring those arguments for good reason. One-off, no commitment parties happen just fine in PF -- see the many Wondrous Tails parties. You can join one of those and get a win without ever saying anything to anyone, and then leave. Current trials and raids would work out just the same.

this act (not saying you) is completely rude to do in JP datacentre. if say, you join a "4 runs alex <insert 9 to 12> savage farm PT" and leave without a word since you only needed 1 page, it would make the people upset and view you as a deserter and a very rude person and worse they could black list you in their "reddit" or message boards such as 2ch and you may end up not being able to join pts next time because you get kicked on sight - thankfully this happens very very rarely as people are very courteous and considerate of others

[Rongway]

[joining a party and leaving after one run without saying anything] is completely rude to do in JP datacentre. if say, you join a "4 runs alex <insert 9 to 12> savage farm PT" and leave without a word since you only needed 1 page, it would make the people upset and view you as a deserter and a very rude person and worse they could black list you in their "reddit" or message boards such as 2ch and you may end up not being able to join pts next time because you get kicked on sight - thankfully this happens very very rarely as people are very courteous and considerate of others

For sure, it would be rude if the party specification was for multiple runs. My reply was in response to people saying that some players don't want to use the PF because they don't want to be obligated to do multiple runs -- my point is that they can use PF without that obligation. Parties in party finder can specify that they only want to do a single run, and there are people who currently do use it that way. It's not rude to leave after one run if the party comment states that the party is only going to do one run.

[Hayward]

All of these Gartrs calling for EX raids to be put back in Raid Finder can just look in the mirror if they need to blame someone. You made the raid population as small as it is because you were too good to lower yourself to showing new players how things are done. Now you're complaining because new players don't know what to do in these raids?

[Doki]

In 2 months it won't matter. They will be steamrolled at level 70 with higher ilvl gear, just like ARR EX primals now.

[bswpayton]

Ex primals are incredibly different from just regular duties. Some that are not even relevant anymore still have mechanics that, if one person messes up, can wipe the entire group (Thordan Ex, Sephirot Ex).

The thing is tho we all know whats about to happen to this content its gona go unsync in like two months so putting it in duty finder now is more than fair to do so. I understand that one person can mess up a whole party trust me I know Ive never joined a farm and got all my clears in learning parties are with friends. But I dont think its unreasable with just a small window for people that want sync clears to have the chance for them in duty finder.

I can understand zur its still relevant but the others are not so I dont see the problem here. And dont understand why this thread is going because the people that are still tryin to do this now are doing so with the knowledge that they could easily wait to do it when it goes unsync , but they are makin their last push and after all this time it shouldnt even matter.