Main Scenario Restriction Bloodstorm - Very Very Bad idea.

[Lewtskie]

You're very specific again with which exact communities to deter but these are communities of games with very opposing views and styles. Anyone as evil and toxic you want to believe will invade our precious little game would probably become uninterested before their trial even ended, and if they stay? Well, congrats, those kinds of people already exist. They always will. Story gate isn't the magical filter that works all the time, and causes harm just as it helps.

If you want to embrace a mainstream audience you'll get mainstream players - the LoL/CoD crowd. The devs stated again and agaun they are commited to a vision - And that's the best thing they can do. And keeping the story gated does WONDERS on shunning off players who won't have much to add to the game but toxicity and ill-behavior.

You say I'm advocating for shunning off people who don't agree with my vision - Well, it so appears that my vision is in line with the devs vision, so it's not what I agree on, but rather what THEY agree on. And again... that exact same discussion occured before HSW launch, and it ammounted to NOTHING - Same as this discussion will not. MSQ OR BUST.

Mainstream audience has merely been a by-product of the real target audience, and they will always co-exist with each other. And the scope of the dev's vision falls under providing, not restricting. Again, there are those who already exist that in your belief are actively going against their vision because they do not put in the time to listen to every bit of dialogue and read every text box. It exists for those who want it, but that doesn't mean it needs to be a detriment to those who would gladly enjoy every other aspect of the game. The devs have shared their wish that everyone enjoys the story provided, but they do not shun anyone uninterested, telling them to leave. You are taking their vision and instilling your own, actively wanting to push away these people if they are not in it from the get go. Gates should exist to an extent as they do filter out certain undesirable entities, and the story gate for HW has served to push against the flow of RMT into HW territories. But over time it becomes a compounding problem and that gate grows higher and higher. It's an issue/non-issue now because from ARR to HW is a week tops of efficient effort. Not desirable to everyone, but tolerable, but this was after HW was released. They did not trim the ARR story at first, and it was still as fat and unappealing in its entirety. Community feedback led to them trimming the fat and streamlining it, making it more what it was meant to be: An introduction to everything, if nothing else.

[AlexionSkylark]

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Well, but they did not get rid of the gating, and that says a LOT.
They have no intention of offering any option for players to skip the MSQ, and it is a welcoming choice. You are ery contradictory in saying that gating the content does not keep certain kinds of players from playing, and you still advocate for an option to skip the MSQ so more players could play the game.

But now I ask you... why do you want that specific kind of player inside Eorzea? what would they bring of positive to the community?
And don't say "money", because Stormblood will have TRIPLE the budget than HSW, so it's not like FFXIV is operating on the red. You talk about what a dev vision SHOULD be in your opinion, not what the devs themselves think of what their goal is. Every game who tried to turn itself into a money-making machine forgetting the original vision and where it came from went down - Name the franchise! Assasin's Creed, Call of Duty, World of Warcraft - Today they are only a bunch of money-sucking SCHEMES who are a shadow of what they set out to be. There's more to game development than just making money, and things made out of love and passion are just as successful, if not more. I don't believe SQEX has any intention of taking WoW's place as the crowned king of MMOs. And it's a good thing they don't.

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Vanilla was pretty OK, actually, at least on Warsong. Can't say however how the band was playing on Illidan or other more "pop" realms. It steadily declined from WOTLK onward, tho. And I really didn't understand what you mean that people cannot immerse in ARR story now. Why not? It's not like there are spoilers aloft everywhere.

[Lewtskie]

[QUOTE=AlexionSkylark;3897795]Well, but they did not get rid of the gating, and that says a LOT.
They have no intention of offering any option for players to skip the MSQ, and it is a welcoming choice. You are ery contradictory in saying that gating the content does not keep certain kinds of players from playing, and you still advocate for an option to skip the MSQ so more players could play the game. /QUOTE]

You claimed that the gate will filter out the toxic types, but these full well exist in the game, will continue to exist in the game, and in the future more will come. These may be the kinds of people deterred by gates, and they may not be. But to insist the gate exists to possibly keep away bad people, you also deter potentially good people. Those who opt to skip aren't by default bad people, toxic people, orpeople who would bring some blight on this community.

You have been insistent that the only people who could possibly choose this option are people are are detrimental to the over grand scheme of the game. They've chosen to bypass one singular element of the game, it's weight comparable to players. I'm not saying what a Dev vision should be because I am telling what it is, what they've stated it to be. I'm holding it up, and saying "This is this." you're snatching it and running off with it, using it as your own. And just about every fully published game in existence is a money making machine, because money is what keeps people alive, and keeps franchises alive.

Gates filter both good and bad players. Jump potions would let both good and bad players bypass gates. You're still going to get one with the other, but I'm choosing to look forward to getting new players who want to enjoy themselves and play with their friends. You choose to focus on the other camp, people who seek to only become a burden. But atleast the potion gives the good players a better opportunity. Perhaps the best route would be locking the potion to the Recruitment campaign. While those completely new with those ties may still face the gate, people trying to introduce friends can give them a chance to join them right at their side from the start and work their way there.

[AlexionSkylark]

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I'm not saying that the only type of player who gets deterred by a gate is the obnoxious kind - But they are the majority. Proof of that is how every game that tries to be inclusive has to deal much more with toxicity than the ones who don't. Nowadays, one of the MMOs with the most mature, less toxic community of all is LotRO. Even it being F2P it has a pretty swell community. And it got to that by catering to a more mature audience, with a higher level of difficulty and lots of gating. And that is a generational thing, yes. People from the younger generations tend to be less amicable online, and are more about the instant reward and gratification - You can refer to a number of studies in that regard, I'm sure you've stumbled about those conversations in the last few years.

There are some white sheeps among those left stranded? Maybe. but they are a minority. And if they hate so much the story... why are they playing FFXIV, anyhow? They'd be happier on other games.

[Lewtskie]

I'm not saying that the only type of player who gets deterred by a gate is the obnoxious kind - But they are the majority. Proof of that is how every game that tries to be inclusive has to deal much more with toxicity than the ones who don't. Nowadays, one of the MMOs with the most mature, less toxic community of all is LotRO. Even it being F2P it has a pretty swell community. And it got to that by catering to a more mature audience, with a higher level of difficulty and lots of gating. And that is a generational thing, yes. People from the younger generations tend to be less amicable online, and are more about the instant reward and gratification - You can refer to a number of studies in that regard, I'm sure you've stumbled about those conversations in the last few years.

There are some white sheeps among those left stranded? Maybe. but they are a minority. And if they hate so much the story... why are they playing FFXIV, anyhow? They'd be happier on other games.

Unfortunately how this game's base design is it will always draw in that younger crowd with short attention and even shorter patience, primarily because how accessible it needs to be for it's actual target audience. There's a bit of me that wishes XIV could remold itself into something that can establish itself in the state Lotro is in, or even how XI used to be in terms of community(not elements). But at the same time I just find refreshing how chill it can be hop on and be able to do stuff. Thus far the only element now not in line with that design, or atleast will fall out of it, is the MSQ. Because as the years pass and the expansions release that does become a longer tunnel to walk through, be it enjoyable one, before someone can reach their friends.

I entered XI late and the peopleI came to know who those who had been playing for a long time. Leveling in that game is what the MSQ is here, though potentially far more enjoyable. It took me months before I could reach 75 and start doing content right alongside them, because they had things they were doing and didn't always have time to just shoot the shit with me leveling. MSQ is much quicker by comparison, but that is certainly how productive you are. In this very thread it did take someone months before they caught up and it can be disheartening. God knows how frustrated I felt trying to catch up to people in XI, even with everything new and enjoyable to me, cause in the end I wanted to hang out with them up there at cap.

So it may not be about hating the story, just it taking a backseat to what's important for them. And I mentioned earlier though briefly, I wasn't much one for the story in HW. To me it started strong, and ended on a damn good note, but everything in between I just was not involved in at all. Just hated certain things that killed it for me. But the lore of this game is fantastic; the history, people and races, politics... kinda(what exists of that anyway) so while the story isn't big for me, I still play it because I enjoy other parts. Obviously you only grow to know the lore going through stories and quests, other bits can be just as attractive. So maybe a potion isn't the right answer, but means of greater condensing does need to be looked at.

[Nayout]

pep.

The same old problem, what is the reason to be at max level? here all content is alive(ok Diadema no kek).

[Reynhart]

Unfortunately how this game's base design is it will always draw in that younger crowd with short attention and even shorter patience, primarily because how accessible it needs to be for it's actual target audience.

With that sentence, are you advocating for or against the gating ?
If it's for, I don't see why you say this is unfortunate, and if it's against, the gating will precisely force people away from this mentality, which is a good thing.