Fat Moogle Mount on Mogstation!

[SagaSoluna]

The amount of self-entitlement and nothing but wild speculation from the anti-mooglestation side is unbearable.
Your entire arguments are nothing but wild guesses and negative, baseless conclusions on what you think that is actually happening within closed doors.

You have no data, no evidence, you have absolutely nothing that proves that the game is worse off due to the inclusion of the mogstation items and again, you have absolutely no proof whatsoever that the items would have made it into the game if the devs could not have monetized them.

Your entire complaints are based on imaginary offenses that may or may not be actually happening.


And while it is true that we cannot prove that mogstation does not affect the game whatsoever either, do remember that the burden of proof falls on you, because you are the ones complaining about it and making claims.

[Skivvy]

The amount of self-entitlement and nothing but wild speculation from the anti-mooglestation side is unbearable.
Your entire arguments are nothing but wild guesses and negative, baseless conclusions on what you think that is actually happening within closed doors.

You have no data, no evidence, you have absolutely nothing that proves that the game is worse off due to the inclusion of the mogstation items and again, you have absolutely no proof whatsoever that the items would have made it into the game if the devs could not have monetized them.

Your entire complaints is based on imaginary offenses that may or may not be actually happening.

And before you tell me that we have no proof of the contrary, while that is true, we are not the ones complaining or making wild claims.
The burden of proof falls on those claiming and complaining.

When someone resorts to insults and rantings, I find that it's normally because they no longer have anything valid to add to a conversation. No side will have proof of anything. You can't claim to be right and that you are exempt from providing proof. We are not in court here.

[SagaSoluna]

When someone resorts to insults and rantings, I find that it's normally because they no longer have anything valid to add to a conversation. No side will have proof of anything. You can't claim to be right and that you are exempt from providing proof. We are not in court here.

My rant is my argument, i am saying that your complaints are void on the grounds that you cannot prove even a single one of them and thus your entire arguments are nothing but wild speculation.

This is not an opinion, this is a fact because you admit yourself that none of us can actually know what´s really happening at Squenix.

You guys are not complaining over an actual problem, you guys are literally complaining over a gut feeling.

So it is certainly not me, the one that has ran out of arguments to bring to the table.
You guys never had any argument to begin with, unless now we accept wild speculation and gut feelings as arguments.

[Skivvy]

My rant is my argument, i am saying that your complaints are void on the grounds that you cannot prove even a single one of them and thus your entire arguments are nothing but wild speculation.

This is not an opinion, this is a fact because you admit yourself that none of us can actually know what´s really happening at Squenix.

You guys are not complaining over an actual problem, you guys are literally complaining over a gut feeling.

So it is certainly not me, the one that has ran out of arguments to bring to the table.
You guys never had any argument to begin with, unless now we accept wild speculation and gut feelings as arguments.

I'm glad you've managed to sum up all of our voices and comments as simply "a gut feeling". Not everyone has been claiming to know the inner workings of SE, but the fact that you keep trying to perpetuate this lie to make your own argument seem better is quite telling. At this point, I am willing to continue to discuss this with anyone else in this thread, but you've proven several times now to be incapable of having a rational conversation.

Also, typing in bold does not make what you're saying more true.

[SagaSoluna]

-[/B].

You are yet to prove that your claims are anything but speculations.
You keep claiming that "i am telling lies" by insisting on that yours are nothing but speculation, but let me pull the dictionary on you:

speculation
ˌspɛkjʊˈleɪʃn/
noun
noun: speculation; plural noun: speculations

1.
the forming of a theory or conjecture without firm evidence.

This is literally what you guys are doing.
Because just like me or anybody else in this thread, you have no firm evidence on what is happening at squenix and how much it affects the game.

So yup, your arguments are speculations.

[Melorie]

wtf

"Anti-mooglestation" holy banana bread, read the topic please. Most people here aren't even talking about the mogstation, they're talking about exclusive items.
No one is saying that the game is worse either, but YES, people are warned because of their decisions and they should be. You don't need to have your afternoon tea at Square Enix escritory to actually know that cash shops should be watched and treated carefully, you just need to play MMOs for some time and watch the MMO market. It's not rocket science. The MMO history is all the proof the one needs to actually be afraid of cash shop moves.
You can ignore that all you want. But then it's your choice, do not come preaching for "proof" like we're at some kind of tribunal here.

It's all a matter of logic. If the item cannot have been made into the game, then why it exists for mogstation? Why the mogstation is the priority for an EXCLUSIVE item? Does it exist because of mogstation money? Then, mogstation is supporting mogstation? Because if that's the case, it's worse. We're not supporting the game paying for items, we're supporting the cash shop itself. The item COULD'VE been a recolour, like Red Fenrir. But no. Putting an exclusive item on mogstation was a CHOICE. A greedy choice.
If you think that this is okay. GREAT. But there's absolutely nothing wrong with not being comfortable with it.

[SagaSoluna]

bbq

Not only have i been playing MMOs since 1999 but i have actually worked at a company that published a game with millions of players (Ragnarok Online EU)

You are entitled to your opinions but cease this condescending tone in which you guys make it sound like anyone with a brain or experience should reach the same conclusion you do because it is incredibly pretentious and fallacious.

Your perception on MMO history/industry is not the standard for the industry, and this is something that you guys seem to literally be unable to fit within your skulls.

And what i am saying is that if the items were not to be monetized, they may not have bothered to create them to begin with.

And you guys really need to stop thinking that your sub entitles you to anything but access to the servers, because it does not, not even legally.

Squenix has the right to spend their earned money in whatever they want.

[Melorie]

snip

Then you probably know what happened to ragnarok online, and many other games. If you think that this is okay, and that the MMO player shouldn't be afraid, that's great. Really. Doesn't change the fact that other people feel different, and if you choose to ignore all their reasons even looking at MMO market I can only guess that you have no empathy at all.

And what i am saying is that if the items were not to be monetized, they may not have bothered to create them to begin with.

Well what makes it worse, don't you think? The fact that the item idea just exist to make money sounds very greedy. They could've put it into the game and they make a recolour, but no. The choice for an exclusive item says much about an intention.
And if you get my suggestion to read the topic, there's already proof of how this idea of "acess to the servers" isn't true. I won't do the job for you though, since you're a person that cares so much about information.

My subs give me the right to give my feedback and my opinion about their moves, deal with it. I am a customer, like it or not. Square Enix asked for my complaints. What everyone is saying here IS feedback, doesn't matter if you don't see it as feedback. If you can't deal with it, leave the forums. I'll stay here watching for the game I like.

[SagaSoluna]

Then you probably know what happened to ragnarok online

Actually, the main problem Ragnarok Online EU faced was the brutal amount of private servers that were born from the fact that you pretty much had to sell your life and soul to the devil and farm 10 hours a day if you hoped to even move that experience bar past level 50.

It had nothing to do with the cash shop.

there's already proof of how this idea of "acess to the servers" isn't true.

The subscription gives you the rights that are detailed in the EULA and the contract that you enter with Squenix upon subscribing.
You accept their terms before you can access the game, so trying to theorize how you actually have extra rights is ridiculous.

Nothing more, nothing less, and in no part of the contract there is a clause that forces Squenix to re-invest into the game for free or gives you special rights upon said game and what they decide to do or do not with it.

[Chalbee]

See, you may not agree with me and have your opinion and I can think that you're wrong, just like you may think that I'm wrong. There's nothing horrible in that. It happens.

In that we are in agreement. I have no desire or ability to police your opinions. But you are using your entitlement to an opinion as a cudgel to attack other posters on this forum, including personal attacks against another poster based solely on their disagreement with your opinion on game philosophy. And you are using it as a shield to basically say you are above reproach on account of being a "customer." We can disagree with one another and still be civil.