The Fields of Glory (Shatter)

[Exira]

When all of the little ice spawns at the same time at the start of the match it makes Shatter such a trash game mode. Please take out this "pattern" because its awful

[Syhrwyb]

Great glorious wall of advice.

Februs the real MVP. I'll make sure to read what you post again and again.

[Eorzean_username]

Thank you Februs, as always your detailed answers help a lot for trying to sort out everything that's going on.

There's one aspect of Shatter in particular I'm still really struggling with as PLD:

Every time a central Ice shatters (especially a Large Ice), there's an awkward period where the 3 teams disengage and hover around the edges of the middle poking at each other. It feels very much like a mini-Slaughter match.

This is where I seem to get scolded the most harshly by frustrated teammates for under-performing. I would like to do better, but I'm not sure what to do, because the 3 teams strongly-prefer to keep their distance at the edges, rather than actually converging in the middle:

• If I try to pursue a marked enemy player — to DPS/Stunlock the target, or lock down nearby healers — I have to dive in to a giant ball of very angry Flames/Mael.
• If I dive in to a giant ball of very angry Flames/Mael, even with all my defensive CDs active, I get CC'd and blown up within ~20 seconds. Then I get scolded for dying (I think that's what "Thank you for feeding them" means).
• If I don't dive in to a giant ball of very angry Flames/Mael,then I get scolded for being "trash melee" that "doesn't engage".
• If I try to pick at the edges and leave myself a safe path of retreat or stay within range of my team, the target just easily slips back into their blob and gets healed/Esuna'd back to full and it's like I did nothing. (And I get scolded for being useless)

It feels like the middle becomes a giant blob of 24v24v24, mostly with the RDPS just picking at each other's fringes while the Healers on both sides keep everything neutral. Sometimes a Tank or Melee DPS runs up to my team's blob, gets beaten on, accomplishes nothing, and then either runs away or gets CC'd and blown up.

Targets keep getting marked, but if I break from my blob to do anything about the marks, I just end up overextended and quickly killed. If I don't break off, I spend the entire inter-Ice period jogging around waiting for an opportunity to engage that never comes (and then I'm scolded for not engaging).

I want to do better, stop frustrating my teammates, and contribute more in these situations, but I don't understand what I'm supposed to actually do as a Tank and/or mediocre MDPS, because I can't find a way to engage anything long enough to apply any of the tips given here.

In contrast, when two teams slam into each other inside a corridor while trying to travel between Ices, or my team cuts off another team's retreat, or one team gets really aggressive and voluntarily enters my team's territory — basically, any time the other team is mashed right into the middle of my own — then I get a lot done, die very little, rack up a lot of Assists, and generally apply a lot of the tips given here effectively.

It's just these mini-Slaughter situations in the middle that make me feel useless so far.

[Thekk]

When all of the little ice spawns at the same time at the start of the match it makes Shatter such a trash game mode. Please take out this "pattern" because its awful

My opinion is that small crystals are the biggest problem of the map. I'm quite happy when they're all gone right at the beginning: there's more fighting going on as people tend to stick to the middle and people don't ignore outposts as much.

[Eorzean_username]

One other thought about this map: I suspect Shatter would be a lot more satisfying with a premade team.

In queue PUGs, it's difficult to communicate all the possible information needed for true strategy quickly and effectively. The commanders I've had in my matches that try to do this tend to exhaust themselves with non-stop macros, links, instructions and exasperation and I don't know how they manage to actually play the match in-between.

When those commander-type players don't appear in a match, I feel extremely lost and confused in Shatter, and the rest of the team also seems to be equally unsure what to do or where to go. Often, either there are too many options, spread out too far... or there seems to be absolutely no clear viable objective for sometimes minutes on end.

I think that's another reason teams have settled into a meta of Uneasy Truce just to get the Ice shattered: it's a strategy that can be easily communicated and managed in a group of strangers without voice chat.

For me, Seal Rock was extremely simple at its core, but still satisfying. I was able to understand the basic strategy entirely within one match, and from there it was about learning how to adapt to the different configurations and just be better at PvP response and tactics.

Shatter, despite the Ice Ice Ice reputation, is actually overwhelmingly complex. At any given moment a team needs to be monitoring unactivated Ice and anticipating potential spawn patterns, watching their base, watching for opportunities to cap enemy bases, watching for opportunities to pincer a team or farm up some kills.

That's all combined with a relatively hostile and confusing map design that heavily punishes exploration, wrong turns, and unfortunate objective placement.

The map also tends to funnel and corral enemy teams into one big giant blender in the middle area (because the edges are so awkward), and in my matches so far it makes the map play like a Slaughter match with a bunch of mazes glued to the sides — 3 giant blobs mashed together at an uneasy distance, jostling around cautiously until one of them loses the positioning game or the LB race, and can be tag-teamed into oblivion.

I think that there are so many different possibilities at any given moment here, that PUG teams devolve into tunnel-visioning the Ice as a mental-bandwidth coping mechanism because it's a simple, easy, reliable point to rally around similar to Tomeliths in Seal Rock. Then afterwards, everyone just loiters around half-heartedly picking at the edges of opposing teams until the next piñata activates.

Other objectives are much higher risk for not necessarily any better reward, and it costs the team badly if the effort fails (to cap a base, take a distant maze-edge Small Ice, try to kill-farm, etc). So poorly-coordinated PUGs avoid it all, in favor of the safety objective in centrally-positioned Small Ices and Large Ices and then picking at stragglers in-between.

When I imagine doing Shatter in a coordinated team, especially fighting other coordinated teams, then the map seems a lot more appealing, because spontaneous tactical responses to all the Consolation Prize elements (splitting teams, controlling Ice, blocking choke points, attacking distant Ice, pursuing non-Ice gains) probably becomes more plausible and more effective, and mitigates the Ice Zerg with other factors.

In actual matches, though, it's just a handful of commanders desperately spamming instructions and macros to huddle in the middle, ignore bases, ignore enemies, ignore everything and just get the Large Ice before anyone else does. I don't think this is anything close to an optimal strategy, but I'm beginning to realize they do this because it has the highest chance of success by far when trying to coordinate and control 8 or 24 PUG strangers (ie, herd cats).

The alternative is like, you know, 5 players go to this Small Ice (only 2 were necessary), 10 players go try to cap the enemy's base (we lose ours in the process), 5 players sit in middle anxiously, and 4 players go try to kill the enemy for points and either accomplish nothing or get picked off. By contrast, "Stay as one giant 24-player blob of death, don't make eye contact with the opposition, and win the Large Ice" is not optimal, but in practice, it works a lot better.

[Aviars]

Had a pretty crazy game just now. I'm a Adder btw. The score was 1720 Maels, 1400 Adders and 1650 Flames with no more crystals, and the end result was 1731 Maels, 1800 Adders and 1781 Flames. The sandwich on the Maels was real haha. Maelstroms must've been upset.

[Dimitrii]

Had a pretty crazy game just now. I'm a Adder btw. The score was 1720 Maels, 1400 Adders and 1650 Flames with no more crystals, and the end result was 1731 Maels, 1800 Adders and 1781 Flames. The sandwich on the Maels was real haha. Maelstroms must've been upset.

We actually werent. There isn't as much passion in this mode as previous modes. I think only one guy even said anything, something along the lines of "unbelievable" but pretty much everyone left without saying a word. I gotta admit I dont really find myself caring much either cause I couldnt care less about a reskin of a mount I already have but I did get enjoyment at least from that nonstop fighting at the end.

[jonbo]

Mael seems to get sandwhiched quite often lol.

[Syhrwyb]

Mael seems to get sandwhiched quite often lol.

It's quite irritating.

[Eorzean_username]

I'm starting to warm up to Shatter a little more, although I still prefer the simplicity and confrontation-supporting design of Seal Rock.

There's a sort-of fun passive-aggressive PvP around the Ice, where no one wants to actually stop their DPS cycle, but while we're rubbing shoulders we do everything we can to interfere with the opponent's DPS: dropping Shadow Flare on the melee, baiting a Shield Swipe and Pacifying a MNK, etc. Last match I had an entertaining rivalry going with a Maelstrom WAR for each Large Ice: every time they popped Zerk I Stunned them, and every time they reached Abandon IV they began to paranoiacally, preemptively Mythril Tempest me.

I think teams also under-estimate Control Points. Multiple times now we've managed a comeback to 2nd from 3rd just by sending a small squad to steal bases while everyone is obsessed with an Ice pop, and matches where commanders insist we ignore bases (including our own) when an Ice pops are often the matches where we narrowly miss 1st place at the end.

I think the middle is too wide and open, though. It's too easy for teams to flee the scene after an Ice shatters and hug the edges, avoiding confrontation entirely and just picking at choice stragglers. I think a smaller, more claustrophobic middle that forces teams to cross over each other between Ice would lead to much more chaos between Ice pops.

I also think that Small Ice is poison for this map. Small Ice die too fast and pop too often to be worth trying much tactics, or often even going after. I have the most entertaining and satisfying matches when it's an All Large map. Other objectives get attention, the Crystal battles feel epic and significant, and holding a Crystal chokepoint feels like a meaningful tactic. Small Ice is a tedious whack-a-mole.

I also retract previous suggestions I made about giving Ice control-point features or Vuln Up debuffs. I think Large Ice works okay as a simplistic objective that everyone can just pile on while trying to insidiously undermine opponent efforts (so many MDPS don't realize they're standing in a Shadow Flare Slow or getting mass-Holy'd by an unnoticed WHM). The map design just needs to encourage confrontation slightly more, to eliminate the awkward and dull down-time periods in-between Ice.