The Fields of Glory (Shatter)

[Titor]

Still not warming up to this mode here. Still feel a little cold to it (ha.)

It seems to be 80% standing around/running around, 18% using your DPS rotations on ice then running away, and maybe 2% PvP if we are lucky. Even in 72 man the map feels way too big. The multiple height levels is annoying too, wtb some Allagan jump pads like we had in slaughter. I mean, my mount is cool and all, but I would really like to actually be doing things not running around (I have plenty of time running around on my mount waiting for the queue to even pop)

[Altena]

individual LB's arent that bad really.. atleast you cant get trolls/new ppl who just use it on ppl and give your team a big disadvantage

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That's part of the issue to begin with though (the fact that LB's have such a big weight on success).. Limit breaks in PvP just simply cheese it up too much. In my opinion it's like getting a chopper gunner or some broken killstreak reward in Call of Duty and killing half the people on the map with it. It requires 0 skill to hit an LB button to kill someone, and depending on what class you play, that could either be a 1-shot on a single person (melee) or do hefty damage to a whole group of people.

Back when they weren't a thing, it was a lot more tactful and required more skill to kill someone (in my opinion).

[TiaHariberux3]

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That's part of the issue to begin with though (the fact that LB's have such a big weight on success).. Limit breaks in PvP just simply cheese it up too much. In my opinion it's like getting a chopper gunner or some broken killstreak reward in Call of Duty and killing half the people on the map with it. It requires 0 skill to hit an LB button to kill someone, and depending on what class you play, that could either be a 1-shot on a single person (melee) or do hefty damage to a whole group of people.

Back when they weren't a thing, it was a lot more tactful and required more skill to kill someone (in my opinion).

You can't spam LB also you can interupt them easily. I think the only thing which could be consider as "op" would be sync mage LB but if you meet a coordinated team its either way a loss so who cares.

[Februs]

Snip.

Well, the first thing I can tell you is that you're taking WAY too much personal accountability for what is supposed to be a group effort. There are very few things in PvP that can or should be done alone. One man cannot attack 8, for example. So, if your team want's you to preform a certain way then they'd damn well better be willing to back you up with adequate heals/dps. If not, then they have not right to complain about anything; so, try not to take that kind of thing personally and/or stand up for yourself.
Now, for that awkward moment you're describing ...

Honestly, I could give you some Pld specific tips for what to do here, but it's not really a Pld specific problem. It's a general tactics problem and a problem with the pacing of the match; wherein everyone in the match is allowing it to stagnate instead of being proactive. In my opinion, you shouldn't be trying to look for the best way you can fit into this situation as a Pld. What you should be doing is trying to avoid this situation entirely, because it's kind of pointless. As you said: ranged dps just sort of pick at one another, and healers heal the dmg. Melee who try to commit either die or are forced to retreat, and Healers are still healing the dmg. Everything is kept more or less neutral between the fighting teams. So, the better question is: why stay locked in a stalemate when you could be doing other things?

When I'm in a similar situation, the very first thing I do when a Shatter Point dies is start looking for my next objective. Unless the enemy is kicking in my teeth (in which case I have a clear objective), I have my map open, and I'm assessing the field. If there's a node up, then the choice is easy. If not, then I have to prioritize my options:

• Withdraw and Scout
• Withdraw and Capture.
• Full Attack.
• Full Defense.

*Side note: For the sake of space, I'm avoiding A LOT of details here, but at the very least I should clarify that I do not consider anything less than two teams vigorously trying to murder one another "combat." If people aren't dying, then it's not a real fight. Shyly giving each other love taps while the healers act as chaperones does not count as an attack or defense, not to me anyway.

After a Shatter Point dies, these are the things that are running through my mind, and I'm trying to decide which is the best option for my current circumstances. Often, a good leader will decide for you, and you just have to follow in. However, even if that's the case, you should still be trying to anticipate that decision so you can react to it faster. The idea is to keep your (and your team's) momentum alive. Stagnating in the middle of the map getting into a tickling contest helps nothing. Staying mobile and having a concrete purpose, on the other hand, is always a benefit. The only problem is making sure that your team is also on board. Most often, that requires having someone making shout outs in the chat box; however that's not the only way to instigate movement.

You should keep in mind that, like all past FL game modes, Shatter is an exercise in mob mentality. The first person to act can cause a ripple in the team, especially if that act is visible, decisive, and within the general shared mentality of the mob. Jumping onto your mount while in the middle of your party and sprinting away from the enemy, for example, is a sure fire way to tell people without words that it's time to move. If your team's general mentality is passive (they don't strike you as over aggressive people who want to fight), then chances are someone in that group will also mount up and follow you. They might not know exactly what you're doing (they're not psychic, after all), but they'll know you're doing something. That's a hell of a lot better than nothing. You just have to get a feel for the mood of your mob to know what actions they are most likely to respond to. If they're hyper aggressive and are out for blood, the chances are good they are more likely to respond to a full attack then they are to a withdraw. They could also prefer capturing to scouting, etc.

The point, for me, is to try to keep the momentum alive rather than trying to figure out what to do after it's dead. Given that we're now in the realm of general tactics, I'm sure a lot of people will disagree with me, but my best suggestion for those awkward moments that you're describing is to try and instigate your team. You want to spur them into action, rather than inaction. Get a feeling for what they are more likely to respond to, and do it. you're basically looking for the linchpin that will set things in motion. The quicker you find it, the better, because a stalemate isn't good for anyone. If your team really is lacking initiative and you're forced to engage in that stagnant blob of pointlessness, then so be it, but if there's another option (and there always is another option), you should be exploring it.

[Eorzean_username]

It seems to be 80% standing around/running around, 18% using your DPS rotations on ice then running away, and maybe 2% PvP if we are lucky.

I agree this is Shatter's weakest point. When I get 24 Small Ice, I ready my /doze emote. It's not even that non-Ice objectives aren't rewarding (kills and bases can rack up tons of points), it's that they're not necessary, so unless one team is feeling aggressive today, everyone just enters this uneasy half-hearted truce standing around waiting for the next Data piñata.

When a match gets aggressive (for whatever reason), it's actually a lot of fun because time between Ice is actually interesting, and the race for the next Ice can become bitter and deadly (another reason I really like 24 Large Ice). Matches become dull when everyone is colluding to avoid conflict so we can Stone Sky Sea in peace (but I blame the design for making this viable).

It would help if the path between bases was a lot less convoluted and time-consuming. Right now, if everyone's standing around and I want to go try to do something sneaky, I either take a suicidal path down the enemy's choke-point corridor (where all 8 or 24 enemies are standing around waiting for Ice), or I take such a long scenic route around the edges that by the time I get to my objective, whatever I was doing has usually lost its purpose.

[Eorzean_username]

tactics

Thank you Februs, that actually helps a lot. I admit it's very hard to take initiative when I'm still relatively green to both the map and PvP in general, I feel so lost and indecisive when there isn't a commander providing instructions in chat (♥ commanders).

It doesn't help that when I have tried to go off and do something on my own, I tend to get disoriented by Shatter's hostile terrain (either totally lost, trapped somewhere in the middle of nowhere, led into a cliff by the confusing 2D map, stumble right into the enemy's traveling caravan and spend 5 minutes playing Kill the PLD ... etc) and waste so much time that I think I just caused more harm than good.

But you're right — at least getting practice making tactical decisions and trying to do something is probably better than just standing around or making pointless half-hearted swipes at a giant blob full of healers. Maybe I'm letting my team down more by being over-cautiously passive than I am by taking a risk and sometimes losing.

[PotatoTree]

Just a tangent and not 100% related to shatter, but how the hell do people on PS4 play this? My PC needs some repairs so I switched to PS4, and oh my god the lag is so bad and the framerate drops + input lag gets to the point where I get motion sickness. It takes like 5-10s before I can even click on someones name to target them.

If a lot of players are playing on PS4, I can understand now why PvP ain't popular, lol.

[Syhrwyb]

People always talking crap about Maelstrom, but they've been good to me. I am now up to 30 Shatter wins!

[Syhrwyb]

Just a tangent and not 100% related to shatter, but how the hell do people on PS4 play this? My PC needs some repairs so I switched to PS4, and oh my god the lag is so bad and the framerate drops + input lag gets to the point where I get motion sickness. It takes like 5-10s before I can even click on someones name to target them.

If a lot of players are playing on PS4, I can understand now why PvP ain't popular, lol.

I have no serious issues with PvP on the PS4 version. Turning your effects down helps a lot with the lag. Also, I don't know what job you play as in PvP, but if you're melee you can clear what you have targeted then put the person you do want to target right in front of you and press X.

[Sirius-Khan]

Just a tangent and not 100% related to shatter, but how the hell do people on PS4 play this? My PC needs some repairs so I switched to PS4, and oh my god the lag is so bad and the framerate drops + input lag gets to the point where I get motion sickness. It takes like 5-10s before I can even click on someones name to target them.

If a lot of players are playing on PS4, I can understand now why PvP ain't popular, lol.

Playing on PS4 makes me hate 72s so much. Secure was ok because majority of the time you only had a portion of the alliance to deal with. Seize, Slaughter and Shatter 72s can go somewhere.