Give Tanks Tank Stance at Level 15

[technole]

Oh, yes, scholars have a bit of a bad low level experience, too. White mages have their skills early on, but scholars have similar problem to low level tanks not having tank stance; they don't get cleanse early enough.

Cleanse isn't a big deal lower level, a SCH has Adlo out of the gate and can just simply Adlo which the poison will end up eating the shield. Most don't do that or really understand how shielding works as "more effective HP" early on in their SCH career. Plus now they have Selene cleanse at earlier level. It was never a problem, and still isn't one.

[Yuella]

I would switch Shield Oath and Cover order. SO at 35, Cover at 40.

[Galactimus]

I agree with this thread. I've been a Paladin since the launch of the game. Mastered the art of Tanking long ago. Completed all savage content while it's current. Holding hate? Piece of cake!


Enter yesterday, where leveling roulette threw me into the {Thousand Maws of Toto-rak}. I began my journey into these halls with a Dragoon and a Machinist as my comrades. With the dungeon memorized, my gear at i240, and my HQ Vitality Potions and Food fully loaded; this party could not have received a more prepared Tank. Let me tell you.. holding hate was an absolute nightmare.


The first 10 seconds of every fight? Welcome to the wonderful world of Machinist tanking. It doesn't matter if you Fight or Flight a Shield Lob, Flash, or Provoke. Not until your Halone combo finishes are you finally able to keep up with their enmity generation and OGCD's. And even then, sometimes they are able to pull it right back before your second Halone combo finishes. Dragoon attacking an unmarked mob? Time to pick which mob you want to tank. Once that first mob dies things start becoming controllable.


While leveling in 2.0 I don't recall a single time where holding hate was difficult as long as your weapon was up-to-date. Now that this content is level syncing and stat capping i230+ players, it's clear the enmity generation algorithm isn't doing Tanks any favors at low levels. These level capped DPS in Toto-Rak were generating 10x more enmity (enmity gauge percentage wise) then i240 DPS in Alexander Savage. I shudder to think about what new tanks are putting up with.

[Anienai]

I shudder to think about what new tanks are putting up with.

Spam dungeons on GLD til 34 and then start the real tank quest.

http://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/wiki/My_First_Axe

[ADVSS]

While leveling in 2.0 I don't recall a single time where holding hate was difficult as long as your weapon was up-to-date. Now that this content is level syncing and stat capping i230+ players, it's clear the enmity generation algorithm isn't doing Tanks any favors at low levels. These level capped DPS in Toto-Rak were generating 10x more enmity (enmity gauge percentage wise) then i240 DPS in Alexander Savage. I shudder to think about what new tanks are putting up with.

hmmm is it really worse than 2.0? 2.0 was pretty awful for gladiator but if this is the case, im not surprised kept saying every other major patch will be 'enmity increased' ah well such is life

[Ilenya]

Cleanse isn't a big deal lower level, a SCH has Adlo out of the gate and can just simply Adlo which the poison will end up eating the shield. Most don't do that or really understand how shielding works as "more effective HP" early on in their SCH career. Plus now they have Selene cleanse at earlier level. It was never a problem, and still isn't one.

That only works after Haukke for Adloquium, and Selene's recharge means any fight with multiple spaced out statuses have some that just slip past. Also, there's an entire guildhest based around statuses and esuna that SCH kinda get shafted on.

[MistakeNot]

For real fun try the very first (level 10) Guild Hest as a brand new Marauder. Good luck keeping enmity there.
(Hint: A level 10 MRD has no AOE abilities, and no ranged abilities.....)

[Soulbrandt]

Pretty much agree. Anybody who says: I've had no issues tanking in low level dungeons: Stop being cool. You're lying your through your teeth or you don't actually play your Tank in any actual dungeons before your stance. They need to either scale down the dps that is done, or they need to give Tanks something to combat the dps that is going out. Marauders used to have ZERO issue before Defiance, and now they're struggling big time even with Maim up-time, OP spam with SS combo. Paladins are screwed until 40, and it is a struggle to even get that Oath.

It's honestly a problem, and anybody saying otherwise is clearly ignoring the fact that a ton of us are having issues. We could be in full 240 and when we get sync'd, we get screwed out of aggro. It's a problem and this needs to be fixed. But really tired of seeing: 'I've had no problems at low levels!' Okay, keep lying or being ignorant, I don't care which.

[Ekimmak]

I haven't been in a really low synced dungeon in a while, and while I won't say that I have any significant troubles, I certainly don't have a problem with some sort of tweak to make it easier.

Heck, I think one of the adjustments they need to make is to disable soul crystals below thirty, because I'd love to have access to extra cross-class skills. Invigorate would be incredibly handy to have to counteract the TP drain of Overpower spam. Sure, you have flash, but have you actually seen how long it takes for Warrior to regenerate MP?

Most painful area is actually the 25-30 area. Butcher's Block comes in far later than other three step enmity combos, and you will feel the difference against DPS that know what they're doing. And the ones that don't, since they'll all pick their own targets and expect me to somehow manage two out of control DPS' targets.

[Awful]

I don't agree with giving tanks tank stance at lvl 15 it doesn't teach you to be a good tank, mind you low lvl tanking is annoying, (for some i.e new players) it teaches you how to tank. If we got tanking stance at 15 all you would have to do is spam flash/unleash/overpower then afk for the rest of the dungeon with no sense of mob management, placement, understanding threat mechanics.

Take for example WoW at lvl 15 you get everything you need for your spec (tanking stance, some heals, extra int/agi/str etc) but it doesn't teach you anything or how to tank/heal as a new player. As opposed to FF14 where yes DPS can pull threat off you at low lvls especially as a Pld since you don't get shield oath till 40 which is pretty awful not going to lie. But when I was lvling my pld and was my first 50 in 2.0 I really learned how to be a better tank and knew what I could handle, what kind of DPS I could handle (looking at you BLMs with your pre-nerf Flares!). The only thing i'd change is Plds get shield oath at 30.

Tanking at lower lvls is fine it teaches you the basics and you'll learn exactly what you need to do and how to manage your threat through lvling and being with different DPS/healers. I love this game to pieces I don't want it turning into another mindless MMO where I just sit there and hit one button over and over again while I watch netflix bored of lvling because i'm hitting just 1 button.