Quote Originally Posted by Ultimatecalibur View Post
Wrong. Using Storms Path is only a 40 potency loss compared to BB. SP -> SE -> BB is only 1.7% less DpS than SP -> BB -> BB. Avoiding Storm's Path is not the incredible DpS gain you think it is.
You just showed me that you have no idea how WAR works. WAR's Optimal rotation is: SE -> BB and Repeat! If you EVER need to apply path, replace a BB with SP (not SE, you never let SE drop).

SP -> SE -> BB is a massive DPS loss compared to SE -> BB. Both debuffs will drop before reapplication NO MATTER WHAT following SP -> SE -> BB. FC/IB/Fracture are just out of the question since if you use any of these you delay 1 more GCD without both of these debuffs.

SP -> BB -> BB is even worse. There is 0 slashing Debuff. And even that doesn't have 100% uptime on SP.

SP -> BB repeat is horrible DPS wise.

SP -> SE is just impossible to hold hate with.

As I said, it is IMPOSSIBLE to deal that 15% more DPS than the other tanks WHILE maintaining SP up. There is just no optimal way to maintain aggro/DPS while keeping both SE and SP up unless you have 2 warriors or WAR+NIN. And even then, 1 of the warriors (or the NIN) is losing DPS at the cost of that.

Because it is not "riskier" (despite what you believe) and grants greater benefits.
WAR is "riskier" because EVERY Fell Cleave you use is NOT Inner Beast. WAR's CDs, for the most part, require them to work for their effectiveness, unlike the press-and-forget nature of PLD/DRK's CDs.

Heck, one of WAR's CDs guarantees critical hits if they're not careful! In before you say add Awareness, you'd be just proving that WAR has to "work" for RI to be foolproof. (Make sure you face enemy or you get crit, or pop another CD).

WAR is all about trade-offs, something NONE of the other tanks deal with. If you want a one-to-one mechanic comparison and where WAR can make said trade-offs I can post again with a list of most of them for you to see how "risky" WAR is compared to PLD/DRK.

Also, the single target melee DpS (DRG, MNK and NIN) are balanced against each other, not against the ranged caster DpS (BLM/SMN) or ranged support DpS (BRD/MCH) (which are balanced against the others in their subroles). When DRG was provably the underperformer and NIN was overperforming during 2.4, NIN received a nerf and DRG received a serious boost in survivablity and DpS in 2.45. We just saw MNK receive some buffs in 3.07.
Single Target melee DPS is in this order: MNK > DRG > NIN. There is at least a 200 DPS variance between these three clases. (Tanks have a whooping 70 between WAR and PLD on a dummy!).

Before 3.07, MNK was basically equal to NIN and both under DRG (by about a 100), MNK got buffed so it is back on top since it provides no raid DPS boost outside of its personal individual DPS. There was a reason people dropped MNK for NIN. DRG was top DPS so it was a given, and between MNK and NIN, NIN provided TA (Direct raid DPS boost) and Goad (Indirect DPS boost) while MNK provided DK... Something that DRK could provide all the while bringing ~3% more DPS than PLD.

BRD/MCH being "support" DPS is an illusion. BRD and MCH are full fledged DPS as much as any other class tagged with a red icon. As I said earlier, SMN provides far more support than BRD and MCH in the form of E4E, Virus, Battle Rez, AOE bind, AOE slow, Blind, and tank pet. Yet SMN is never called "Support" and is above BRD and MCH in ST and just knocks EVERYONE out in AoE.

And again, there is ONE class that is worse than NIN in AoE, it happens to be a non-DPS class called PLD! (lol)... Why aren't NIN complaining that DRK and WAR, heck, even the healers, outdo them in AoE scenarios?

Again, PLDs asking for DPS increase are just looking at DPS in vacuum and forgetting everything else the classes have/deal with. I already posted what PLD needs and won't reiterate anymore.

This thread is already outta hand and should just die. There are more objective threads discussing tank balance out there instead of this asinine dragoon-minded one where the supporters of it are calling anyone who disagrees with them "Stupid" or "hypocrites".