ooids for sale on MB, 500k ridiculous

[Seyb]

Nice picture. Is that you while you're reading things about crafting? DarthBuzzer already explained my point, but here is another example: A recipe needs materials. Materials are gathered by gatherer classes. These materials are then processed by crafters to create, for example, gear. Some high level gear can be exchanged for red scrips. To gain enough scrips for the week, many crafts are to be exchanged, thus, a lot of materials are to be gathered OR bought. No gatherer = buy materials from others = high gil costs.
The current system seems like an awful gil sink that not many people want to participate in (among other things, but I don't need to relist them all).

[Unaki]

Nice picture. Is that you while you're reading things about crafting? DarthBuzzer already explained my point, but here is another example: A recipe needs materials. Materials are gathered by gatherer classes. These materials are then processed by crafters to create, for example, gear. Some high level gear can be exchanged for red scrips. To gain enough scrips for the week, many crafts are to be exchanged, thus, a lot of materials are to be gathered OR bought. No gatherer = buy materials from others = high gil costs.
The current system seems like an awful gil sink that not many people want to participate in (among other things, but I don't need to relist them all).

I think that even you don't understand the point that you made.

But still, there is no denying that the people with only a few crafts and no gatherers are pretty much screwed because they pay a hefty price for each red scrip. This shouldn't be intended...?

If you meant something entirely different then you should probably fix this, otherwise its looking like you are saying that those that put in no effort to level the relevant gathering class for their class shouldn't be paying as much as they are. All of the vitriol surrounding red scrips is nothing more than a bunch of people crying for instant gratification.

[Seyb]

I think that even you don't understand the point that you made.



If you meant something entirely different then you should probably fix this, otherwise its looking like you are saying that those that put in no effort to level the relevant gathering class for their class shouldn't be paying as much as they are. All of the vitriol surrounding red scrips is nothing more than a bunch of people crying for instant gratification.

No, not at all. Please do more research on this subject. There are many crafters stating valid concerns without exaggerations. You are ignoring them or even worse, say they are crybabies. Discussing about pros and cons is good. But we don't need you to make invalid statements. You are right about one thing. Crafters that don't put as much effort into the gathering/crafting universe should be paying more. But did I ever say anything against that? No. Reread this:

they pay a hefty price for each red scrip

As of now, those crafters would pay insane amounts of gil to cap their red scrips every week. Thus (you omitted my other statemtent), it seems that the system is currently made for omnicrafters with omnigatherers. Other crafters have to wait it out. Is this fun for them? I don't think so. Will it change over time? Probably. Are they all crybabies because of this? No.

You can actually compare this to esoterics. Do people who don't raid or do ex primals need esoterics gear? No, not necessarily.
Do you need red scrips gear for 2 star crafts? No, not if you don't mind melding A LOT.
Does the gear locked behind those two currencies look great and everyone wants to start working towards them? Hell yes!

Do you understand it now?

[Kabooa]

You can actually compare this to esoterics. Do people who don't raid or do ex primals need esoterics gear? No, not necessarily.
Do you need red scrips gear for 2 star crafts? No, not if you don't mind melding A LOT.
Does the gear locked behind those two currencies look great and everyone wants to start working towards them? Hell yes!

I need to preface this with I found all of your posts I have read reasonable.

I do want to address the quoted part though; It's an awkward comparison and largely feels out of place. This is mainly because the system now being used for all areas of the game for progression was in place for one since 2.0 (or earlier, didn't play then) and the other is a complete paradigm shift. It's really too early to tell if that's a bad or good thing. I'd rather shine on the side of optimism, because the odds of it getting worse are pretty slim. I mean, what they've done is add a lot of knobs and levers they can tune.

The system they have as a base is fine. It needs tweaks, but in terms of concept and purpose I'd say it hit the nail on the head. (Course, the purpose can only be speculated, but if the purpose was to ensure everyone stayed self sufficient, hoooo did they miss that one.)

Things that need to happen
-Gathering turn ins for red scrips needs to go up. It's -doable- as it is now, but it largely assumes you play around 2-3 hours a day and waste none of that time on silly things like drinks or bathroom breaks, or duty queue times.
-Favor time consumption really needs to go down somehow. It's an odd design because it does it damn well but it doesn't work for those with the '2-3 hours' a day, or less. Favor basically rewards you for getting the materials you / other crafters need to turn in collectibles by giving you the materials for 2star turn ins. That sounds convoluted, but collectibles drain materials from the system. It's a good idea. It just needs a way to be less time intensive.
-It really wouldn't hurt to give crafters -two- red script turn in choices per profession.

[Seyb]

I agree, it is difficult to directly compare disciples of hand and war/magic, if not to say impossible.
My comparison simply shows why I fully understand people that are frustrated because they cannot yet get the new gear.

I don't say they have to be able to get the gear immediately. I believe that this gear will last at least as long as the former AF gear for DOH/DOL lasted. Given the amount of effort it takes to get it, though, it should last even longer.

Your 'things that need to happen' sound reasonable. Especially your last point could involve a 'special' craft for each disciple like the former crafts for the master books.

[Sibyll]

Things that need to happen
-Gathering turn ins for red scrips needs to go up. It's -doable- as it is now, but it largely assumes you play around 2-3 hours a day and waste none of that time on silly things like drinks or bathroom breaks, or duty queue times.
-Favor time consumption really needs to go down somehow. It's an odd design because it does it damn well but it doesn't work for those with the '2-3 hours' a day, or less. Favor basically rewards you for getting the materials you / other crafters need to turn in collectibles by giving you the materials for 2star turn ins. That sounds convoluted, but collectibles drain materials from the system. It's a good idea. It just needs a way to be less time intensive.
-It really wouldn't hurt to give crafters -two- red script turn in choices per profession.

I'm not sure why they didn't make the red scrip turn ins require a token style craft that uses legendary node mats. Currently the legendary nodes are only used in 1*/2* crafting and in low enough quantities that only HQs of these mats are desirable. This poses a problem as the market boards are flooded with NQ of these mats that serve no purpose. If it seems too restrictive they could've just had it be an alternative craft for red scrips. I mean they already do this now with the gathering scrips: Adamantite and Folklore nodes give the same number of scrips.