Endgame toxicity

[Lewtskie]

The logic is simple: we don't inconvenience others in df by going in to learn because that's supposed to be the more convenient method of looking for clears.

If we want to learn, we use the pf. Most of the times after a certain trial is released to the df, it's not as impossible to clear as EN servers seem to think simply because of the different methods in which we use to learn content.

Would have been nice if we got big signs saying "Use this thing in this way!" or "Use this mechanic for this situation!". But we didn't so it never had a defined purpose. People took to PF more since it lets you go in with a chosen hand, which people felt more comfortable with than just drawing at random from the deck. Even let you alter the team make-up in case you felt you needed more/less Tanks and Healers. That, I suppose, felt the more logical choice.

Not trying to be dismissive so much, but I would ask how often have you seen failure state through DF and what caused any abandons.

[OPneedNerfs]

Char Limit

It's really something that one needs to experience to truly understand.

Try going into a JP based server, assuming you aren't undergeared/without knowledge of whichever instance you are doing and queue for DF. The ease of clearing "extremely difficult content that requires pre-made groups" through DF will shock and amaze you. Which might also make EN based servers seem like they're definitely doing something wrong.

The times DF has failed has been due to people who simply do not follow the "rule" followed by most if not all of the JP players to come prepared if you're queueing for DF.

Not trying to be racist of anything but it's ALWAYS people with EN clients and not those with JP. Even then, the times when we(me and my friends in the same server) have run into said situations of failure are few and far in between.

EN players seem to have given themselves a bad name due to their mindset of "DF is for learning". I've had many instances where as a EN client user myself have seen JP groups who I get queued with will expect me to perform badly until I prove otherwise, which results usually in getting a shitton of commends at the end of it all. It's almost as if being on EN client and performing well are mutually exclusive in the eyes of JP players thanks to their run-ins with said EN players who go into DF to practice instead of looking to clear.

[Lewtskie]

So failure primarily comes from people ignorant of their use of the system, but again, there is nothing within the game to tell someone how to use said system. So obviously it has to come from word of mouth from the playerbase.

And maybe there has been an extreme shift in behavior since my time from playing XI, but back during those years a large portion of the JP playerbase weren't ones to actively involve themselves with western players.

So I have to wonder how well this information comes to any westerner playing on their side, let alone onto our server sides. So I suppose that's what bothers me the most. That they've given a bad name purely because nobody told them otherwise from an earlier point, and then proceed to misjudge accordingly.

But as you say, it's a system that works. They've better adapted to playing with whatever comp is given, and that's good. But I have to wonder if that's just the nature of the JP player. That's getting into something entirely different though.

[LTEvil]

Well I think the bias is still there. But it's like any stereotype. They are usually based on some truth. NA has built a rep for selfishness and lack of responsibility. So this makes some jp anti en. This isn't because they hate en or NA. Its just they expect the worse. This is less of an issue in ffxiv however. Since community rep is greatly reduced on this game compared to ffxi. Also this game is vastly more popluar.

[Sapphic]

The irony is a lot of people who set up those parties with their restrictions and demands are made by people who end up being carried by the rest of the group and kick up a storm if they are the ones falling behind in DPS or dying when someone mentions they should get kicked according to their own PF rules. Personally I think they should of just added EX modes to DF, despite the negative connotations people have with DF the reality is I have had almost as much success with DF groups as I have with PF ones.

Exactly why I stick to static/FC and don't bother with PF. Content sellers have a hand in the blame of this also. Carrying players through content who cleared with no idea what to do because they died at the start to prevent wipes. Then go on to make farming parties to not pay for more carries.

If they actually made an effort and learnt the fights instead of paying for carries then they wouldn't need to pay ever again and the quality of players would improve.

Content sellers are the cause of what is bad is FFXIV, promoting bad play, why learn when you can pay someone to carry plus promoting buying Gil. Anyone who disagrees with that are in denial. As I have been partied with players who paid for content that had zero clue, and I know content sellers that told me they had to wait for the buyer to recieve their bought gil to pay for the clear.

[Blood-Aki]

snip

This is true, i came from Mateus, a truly awful server in terms of progression for anything endgame, but the data center is shared with a high population server, but DF is just as bad, couldn't get a single EX primal done outside a messy Garuda. I came to tonberry and flawlessy cleared each EX primal fight and could easily farm them in DF, before i lost interest in the game. and would have done turn 9 if i fully understood jp method, wipes are rare and it's usually because one person came in unprepared. They simply do not treat DF like a "carry me please" session.

[thunderbreak]

So... make your own group? I'm confused. If you don't like the group and its rules, don't join it. Simple.

I think you are missing the point, subject is end game has lots of ass holes, and PF is just used as an example.

[kanjitai]

I stay away from endgame content for this particular reason. The sad thing is it makes me miss out on some story. The good thing is that there's still a lot to enjoy in the game and as content becomes older it's easier to do. Because the elitists move on to the new stuff and the people who play for fun get grouped up more. It still sucks you got to wait and I agree with the OP that some players in 14 are jerks but you can't fix it.

[Elazu]

Content sellers are the cause of what is bad is FFXIV, promoting bad play, why learn when you can pay someone to carry plus promoting buying Gil. Anyone who disagrees with that are in denial.

Looks like you are in denial. Content BUYERS are what's wrong, since they create the market for sellers.

I stay away from endgame content for this particular reason. The sad thing is it makes me miss out on some story. The good thing is that there's still a lot to enjoy in the game and as content becomes older it's easier to do. Because the elitists move on to the new stuff and the people who play for fun get grouped up more. It still sucks you got to wait and I agree with the OP that some players in 14 are jerks but you can't fix it.

This is hilarious. Do you honestly believe that people doing endgame are not having fun? Really?

On another note, since I just experienced it again. You know what is REALLY toxic? The hunting community.

[Destomius]

I think you are missing the point, subject is end game has lots of ass holes, and PF is just used as an example.

Just like every other game? It's impossible to make the assholes just go away. It's dumb to let them ruin the game for you.