Why bring MNK to anything anymore?

[Ephier]

I mean 1 mercy in a 4 minute parse is like, you can do it once in t10 in less than 4 minutes.. so...

Spike damage on openers skews parses, especially if it crit. Most NIN videos I have seen exclude assassinate entirely. Also, its more like 2~3 mercy strokes. You are giving an example of one fight where that is applicable. T11, no mercy stroke til add phase, T12 no mercy stroke until add phase (unless you are on bennu's but not sure why you would put melee on bennu if you have 2 ranged, given your setup is like this), T13 no mercy stroke until p2.


In the video below the MNK crits a mercy stroke and you can see the spike DPS he got from it. It occurs between 0:20 and 0:23.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WVnFWIo1B6E


It's also not really about being able to use it within the first 4 minutes, It's more a matter of using it within the first 30 seconds. Openers play a HUGE part on final DPS in dummy parses.

[Atreides]

Now put a Ninja to the monk, giving him Trick Attack every minute and all the mercy strokes don't matter anymore.

[Ephier]

Now put a Ninja to the monk, giving him Trick Attack every minute and all the mercy strokes don't matter anymore.

That argument is not applicable. The NIN would have to use Assassinate to even it out.

[Atreides]

That argument is not applicable. The NIN would have to use Assassinate to even it out.

It's applicable when none of both use it, Nin parse with Trick Attack, Monks without it. Have a Ninja with you to apply Trick attack and you're on with a real accurate parse.

[Ephier]

It's applicable when none of both use it, Nin parse with Trick Attack, Monks without it. Have a Ninja with you to apply Trick attack and you're on with a real accurate parse.

No because you are not guaranteed to have a NIN in all of your parties, while the NIN is guaranteed to have trick attack in all of its parties. That's like saying parses aren't accurate because there is no selene there for buffs.

[Atreides]

No because you are not guaranteed to have a NIN in all of your parties, while the NIN is guaranteed to have trick attack in all of its parties. That's like saying parses aren't accurate because there is no selene there for buffs.

The fact remains that Nin work with a debuff that works for all classes and have access to it while parsing, so when a Nin does about the same damage as a Monk he will of course beat them because Monks do not have access to it.
On a parser it's easy to beat a Monk but if said Monk hits on the same dummy it's a whole other story.
If anything Ninjas beat monks in offensive utility.

[Ephier]

The fact remains that Nin work with a debuff that works for all classes and have access to it while parsing, so when a Nin does about the same damage as a Monk he will of course beat them because Monks do not have access to it.
On a parser it's easy to beat a Monk but if said Monk hits on the same dummy it's a whole other story, yet they are in denyal because they don't want any other classclose to them.
If anything Ninjas beat monks in offensive utility.

The fact remains that you will not always have a NIN in your party so those parses will not always reflect the trick attack damage. Which is why I gave the Selene example. While Selene may boost my damage, I am not guaranteed to see her out giving me fey light every fight, therefore she is excluded from all of my parses. Things like food and pots are acceptable because they are something that I will always have available for myself. NIN has a similar situation with WAR putting up their Storms Eye for the NIN, but in a parse I would never allow that because I am not always guaranteed to have a WAR in my party and even then I might not get SE from the WAR when he is due to having to deal with mechanics ETC.

[alsims2007]

im not even sure why monk and ninja still need to be compared. In the hands of a top player I've seen no significant difference between the 2 with or without trick attack. The main point is ever application of huton lowers ninja dps and any breaks in combat can lower monk +slow start. Top player know how to manage and mitigate or negate dps drops. In a 3 minute parse ninja should out dps monk. Get a paeon or goad and make it 10minutes (random number) and monk should come out on top. I haven't seen a fight where a 3 minute or 10 minute dummy parse means anything other than who has the bigger epeen. All this tread is doing is make players think monk isnt viable (the same thing that happened when everyone said positionals were hard).
The lesson to learn here is play what you like and get good at it. It's still not perfect but they did a good job at balancing the classes (I said not perfect) ;P

[alphamax112]

Just coming to say I don't like this thread's title. This game has nearly perfect job balancing. Why do we need to make other ppl think MNK is worse than NIN/DRG?
Just FYI, there are many raid groups out there crying about how hard T13 is without Dragon Kick while no ppl say "we hit enrage because we don't have TA"

I hope there will be no similar thread like this in 3.0 cos more jobs are coming.

[KurisuChie]

snip

With a Ninja like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BfwucJOTTsA I'm skeptical that there will be no difference.