It's time to reevaluate the idea of adding a PLEX/Chronoscroll-like system to FFXIV

[Magis]

I never claimed it a be all and all solution. But it's reasonable to conclude that it will hurt RMT spammers, which is good.

Well, shutting down the game would also hurt RMT, but no need to cut your nose off to spite your face. The risk to the game is a bigger threat than some RMT spam which could be killed using conventional anti-spam measures.

Oh please, if he wants to play "games" with me, I will play.

I'm quite sure he can tell an argument from evidence. But if he is going to pretend he can't, so will I.

What? Evidence isn't a substitute for an argument, it is used to back up your argument. If you can't back it up, then it's meaningless conjure based on your personal opinion. If you want to argue that this would kill or damage RMT without breaking the games system, then show some evidence of it happening in other MMOs. The only example I (and I am sure you) can think of is EVE Online... a game that was planned and built around PLEX. This is not the case for games like Tera and Wildstar which have failed or gone F2P (a failure point of an MMO in most people's book anyway).

All of you P2W naysayers should just put your hands over your heads and think...

People WITH MORE FREE TIME say: It's OK for people with more free time to have an advantage in the game.
People WITH MORE FREE TIME say: It's NOT OK for people with more money IRL to have an advantage in the game.

Like I said... it's all about mantaining your priviledges, huh?

Uhhh, wut? Yes, people who put more effort into playing the game get more back, WOW SUCH A NEW AND REVOLUTIONARY CONCEPT! If you don't have enough time cause of your TWO JOBS!1!1!!! then maybe MMORPG's are not for you. Or better yet, realize that you don't actually "need" everything in the game. This isn't a single player game where you can get 100% completion or something. SE even goes out of their way to cater to your playstyle (as much as dislike it) when most content can be completed relatively quickly, they nerf content, and basically make all gear worthless every patch cycle so you never fall too far behind.

I wonder if this is the problem here. That a lot of non-MMO players bring their single player game mindset into MMOs and then are shocked when they can't get 100% in everything.

[Tiggy]

Evidence isn't a substitute for an argument, it is used to back up your argument.

Exactly. They won't supply evidence and then we get insulted for asking for some. Looking at you AlexionSkylark.

That's why I keep saying people are arguing opinion. Because they refuse to back it up with evidence.

[KayoZ]

Elementary my dear ... Duuude007.

A PLEX type system basically allows anyone to be a gil seller. When you buy a game-time token and pay for it in gil, you are effectively selling gil. The more sellers of gil there are, the lower the price of gil. RMT earns less.

Right now RMT has a monopoly on RL money to gil conversion. With a PLEX system, their monopoly will be broken.

Anything that will screw over those RMT spamming bastards is a positive in my book.

For the 100th time, it doesnt hurt them at all. They will still spam, they will still bot, still hack and steal gil, and still make plenty of profits. In fact this may even help them out even more. Sure, some people will buy from SE now to lower the risk, but SE will never be able to compete. There is a limit on how much gil players are willing to buy game time with, and SE cannot sell this "token" for any less than the price of a sub (well, the can but there is no point). All this does is legalize it and get even more players buying gold on both ends. Maybe even get the illegal RMT to double there efforts to entice players with even more annoying ads, get players to buy more from them with lower prices.

No game that has tried this has stopped them or even helped the situation at all. Not Eve, not Wildstar, none! All it does is fill both pockets with more money, make players more dependent on buying gold to make their gil instead of increasing supply through crafting or actual gameplay. As much as I expect todays "gamers" to be perfectly ok to throwing money at a game to actually play less of it... just admit that and be done with it. Claiming that this is a good thing thatll stick it to those mean gold sellers that have been hacking and annoying us for years now, is dishonest and proven false.

[AlexionSkylark]

I'm not making assumptions, I'm merely stating what I read in those 27 pages.

And yes, I find it really funny how one advantage is accepted while the other is not.

[MilesSaintboroguh]

Here's the main issue:

People think the only way to combat RMT is to give "legal" alternatives, which would also get abused by RMT. What Square needs to do is make it harder for RMT to get in touch with players. Right now, we have zero customization for communications; we can't have tells filtered to friends only, we can't auto reject friend requests, etc. Let people filter who can send them tells and let people decide whether or not they want friend requests open. Those two methods of communication is what RMT uses a lot aside from shouts. Make those harder to go through and you made it harder for RMT to get through to people.

[Tiggy]

I'm not making assumptions, I'm merely stating what I read in those 27 pages.

And yes, I find it really funny how one advantage is accepted while the other is not.

Until you supply evidence it's an assumption and an opinion. Others agreeing with you is simply confirmation bias. It is not proof. And since it's a suggestion you guys are pushing then burden of proof to show it works falls squarely on you.

Simply put talk is cheap. Find evidence and prove it. Otherwise you're words have about as much meaning as a drop of water in the ocean. Just another opinion in the endless pool if internet opinions.

If you think square is going to add this to the game without the kind of substantial proof like what we are looking for then you are deluded. If you can't even prove it to us why do you think Square will even listen? If you want to prove the point that your idea will work THEN ACTUALLY PROVE IT. This would be a considerable time/money investment from Square. This isn't something small and flippant or even easy, and you expect everyone to just trust you? Do you really think it's that simple? If you do that says a lot about your understanding of how software development and large companies like this operate.

[Synestra]

Lol, what a straw man. If you think those extra two retainers make people fortunes then you have a really large misunderstanding of what those retainers are capable of.

Well he kinda have a point as with 80 selling slots you have the potential to crash sertain item prices with mass flooding, when undercutting war starts buy everything then withdraw your flood items and skyrocket prices again. This might not work when doing alone but if you have a "cartel" then its alot easier.

[ScarletDawn]

How does Bishop not understand how EvE works? You balance inflation with deflation ( ships being PERMANENTLY REMOVED FROM GAME) The bold part is the key here.

In FF14 we have very very weak money sinks, MB taxs us, teleporting takes very small amount. Repair are minor. List is endless, but there is no 1mil+ money sinks nothing to sap gil from players accounts like there is in EvE when that shiny new carrier costing 2 bil just blew up on ur screen, that is 2 bil in value gone from ur account. 2 bil you probably plexed to gain.

OP just wants a system to abuse the crafting and make easy money, while freeloading off those paying for the game.

[Magis]

How does Bishop not understand how EvE works? You balance inflation with deflation ( ships being PERMANENTLY REMOVED FROM GAME) The bold part is the key here.

In FF14 we have very very weak money sinks, MB taxs us, teleporting takes very small amount. Repair are minor. List is endless, but there is no 1mil+ money sinks nothing to sap gil from players accounts like there is in EvE when that shiny new carrier costing 2 bil just blew up on ur screen, that is 2 bil in value gone from ur account. 2 bil you probably plexed to gain.

OP just wants a system to abuse the crafting and make easy money, while freeloading off those paying for the game.

The only big money sink I can think of is housing but that has a limited amount of money that get's drained once everything fills.

[AlexionSkylark]

Snip.

Wait, what exactly do I have to prove?
My point here is really, really simple: There's nothing inherently wrong with giving people with less free time the opportunity for them to participate in content they're denied of (housing, crafting). And I'm calling out those elitists who think are entitled to their exclusivity just because they spent more time playing.

Why does that need "proving"?